Rangers Banter Archive July 17 2013

17 Jul 2013 22:45:15
Strongest rangers starting 11 for this coming season i'm my opinion, bell, foster, mohsni, pandza, Wallace, Hutton, mcleod, law, templeton, daly, miller, what about that team?

3 players who don't play for Rangers though. 2 who fair enough are unattached and may or may not sign but 1 who is starting every game, scoring and assisting in the MLS.

No Hutton, Smith left back, Wallace left midfield.

Our strongest team could be

Buffon
Cafu Staam Maldini Carlos
Zidane Pirlo Ronaldinho
Messi Ronaldo
Ronaldo

wish these posts would stop! you have 3 players in there we don't even own!

@3 am no wanting Ronaldo upfront kin we have Henry instead?

Larky Bear

Ally will make Brazilian Ronaldo look ripped!

Mines is
BELL

FOSTER, JIG, GASPAROTTO, WALLACE

PERALTA

LAW MCLEOD TEMPS

DALY CLARK

DECENT A THINK

GERSDAFT

17 Jul 2013 21:30:16
Just like to point out to Larky that I still enjoy his posts and no offence was intended,. TB

None taken mate I annoyed myself bud it has only been recently I've been spouting my nonsense anyway as I was getting a bit worried. Works deed mate hee haw better to do than feck about on our phones got to take it out on somebody n Charles is ripe for it lol. Anyway thinking positive & I'm very excited for the new season.

Larky Bear

17 Jul 2013 21:19:09
Another 1-0 for the lads
in germany tonight big
lee hitting the winner
the boy Clark scored but
it was disallowed big c/b
billy had another good game.
billy h

17 Jul 2013 20:11:35
Share trading volume 430,000 today. price fell by 15%. somebody big is selling. good or bad news?. depends who it is.

How can it be good news? Green etal are tied in so it must be an institutional investor which surely means bad news? not an expert so happy to be corrected.

Yes looks bad, but remember for someone to sell someone else is willing to buy.

Would be more worried who is buying in than who is selling out?

OP - if we knew exactly what makes shares go up and down then I for one would not be working for a living.

lets just say it is a buying opportunity for now

interestingly as lots of people want the fans to own the club and we already own 8%, then to buy another 43% for controlling interest, it would take 50,000 bears to buy 242 quids worth of shares at the current price and then pool them together (Paddy you seem to be tracking the trades so watch out for a wee one coming later this morning)

saying that though and knowing us bears, if we canny get half a dozen of us to agree on any issue on here how would we manage to pool 34,000,000 shares together

Kieran Prior where are ye now?
or
maybe he was offloading yesterday!

JG

@2 in large volumns yes, buyers matched with sellers, but not allways

Most likely sockbrokers will hold this. and mean they could get burnt - if stock suspended as there will be no buyers.

big concern - investors do do walking away

17 Jul 2013 16:20:20
Don't shoot the messenger but the arse has fallen out of the share price. Anybody know why?

Paddy Malarkey

Going down fast Institutional investors will dump theirs before it goes any lower, today so far has wiped nealy 7m off the share price

Ed, I don't understand these share
price things so excuse me if I'm wrong
but for share price to go up does it not
need someone willing to sell/buy.
billy h {Ed001's Note - yes, though it can also just be a simple case of someone selling a bulk load of shares, someone else seeing that and thinking they must know something and selling their shares in that company and so on. It is difficult to tell why a share price drops, unless there is a public statement of some kind that drives the price down. In this case, it is most likely that those who picked up cheap shares are now unloading them to make a profit.}

Not too clued up about the market but am right in saying is dropped 14% since about 1. 30pm today?

Any financial bears know more about this?

17 Jul 2013 17:28:44
round about Jan shortly after IPO people on here
bleating and bragging about how much Higher Rangers were valued compared to Celtic figures of £20M above Celtic were quoted ONLY 6 months later and Celtic have maintained their Value yet Rangers have dropped to £18. 18M UNDER Celtic.
Problems are starting to manifest to the extent that mythical debt for Celtic is being suggested here to carry on the feelgood factor and once again keep peoples heads in the sand and don't ask searching questions regarding Ibrox Finances. JohnnyG

Could be because someone knows something, or possibly the fallout from Cenkos heading for the exit. {Ed001's Note - it is more likely that they were over valued initially and so people are selling before they reach that value to make some money.}

Its the end of the world as we know it. lol, as cprporal Jones used to say "don't panic"

Over 400000 shares were sold in less th a n one hour

100,000 shares were being sold at 45p today at 4 o'clock. Anything to do with the Big Tax Case Appeal tomorrow? DH

Question is will the sale continue tomorrow or will it level out

17 Jul 2013 18:40:36
Walter is going to walk and certain investors know this and want out.

Salmon Leap Bear

Cheers ed
billy h.

Expert analysis of today's trading for Rangers International Football Club from the Stock Exchange:
Rangers International Football Club Plc thrown to the bears as it ends trading with dire losses of -15. 00%. Trading commenced on a positive note for the security, which opened at 51. 5, exceeding the previous session's best level, but then gradually lost ground as more exchanges were made before rallying to a close of 42. 5, around the session high. In the last week Rangers International Football Club Plc underperformed the UK FTSE All Share index, therefore showing a lower performance than the benchmark.
Share prices can fall or rise because of speculation, insider knowledge or just people selling or buying shares.

Ed would it not help share price if there was some word on audited accounts? If there was interim accounts for the first five month's of Charles Green's take over (in December last year) the accountants must be able to produce something soon? There is enough concern in the average bear's mind never mind these financial laddies. Appreciate individual companies have different tax years but it is better to know even if the news is bad. {Ed001's Note - it might do yes, depends on the figures. The problem is that not knowing can often have a worse effect than knowing, even when they aren't good figures. People panic when they don't know and rumours fly everywhere.}

@2) Agreed. The question is though why dump them now? Rangers in the SPL in a few years would mean shares being worth a considerable amount more. Is something bad on the horizon? Today seen good new with the SFA announcing they won't be investigating Green/Whyte link, I would think that would be one more reason to feel safe holding onto the shares. Maybe nothing, but again strange timing.

18 Jul 2013 01:19:47
maybe they have seen the audited accounts before they are released and thought i'm outta here

17 Jul 2013 15:26:34
With all that has been said about if its a good idea or not to bring back Kenny Miller, I still remember him fondly for his bullet header he scored when we had 9 men in the cup final against St Mirren Great goal-Great day!

Agreed, think he took a lot of unnecessary flak when he came back to us and worked hard to get some back on his side. The days of players being loyal to one club are long gone. That said, he never did anything to shame us unlike some. No scandal just head down and working hard.
All that said, I don't think that's the signing route we should be heading down.

Also find it a it embarrassing that a professional like Miller gets the "stick your Kenny Miller up your ar53" treatment yet an idiot like Diouf was hailed a messiah purely for being a noise up merchant as he did eff all on the park.

Plus he's 83 now

Spot on baby bear Kenny miller served is well am not sayin rush oot n sign but doesn't deserve some of the guff that gets wrote on here!as u say people get plaudits because he wound folk up!i remember the brox would go wild for sebo n that muppet couldn't score in a brothel!kenny done us well

17 Jul 2013 13:42:04
Ed do you think its true that tickeus own rangers and Charles green fronted them? {Ed001's Note - personally, no. There just wouldn't be enough money in the deal for it to be worth their while going to all that trouble. They are part of a multi-billion dollar corporation, they aren't going to mess about for a few scraps like this. It is just not big enough amounts of money involved for them, in my opinion.}

17 Jul 2013 14:57:20
Hope Ed is right but am suspicious myself as there are so many connections that link Ticketus and Brian Stockbridge. {Ed001's Note - that could be put down to simply being how he found out about an opportunity that is presented, as much as them being involved. That is how most business is conducted, through contacts giving you information you can act on, after all.}

I don't think Ticketus can be ignored till the Whyte-Green issue is sorted out. If Whyte wins this there could be massive problems.

What utter dross. Firstly Whyte guaranteed loan personally. He said that at the time and Ticketus have confirmed, hence the reason they are going after him. In fact this was only true words to come from that person's mouth. Secondly oldco went bust, their only possibility would to be a creditor.

You cannot sue somebody for a loss then if you don't win or don't get paid (more likely), then go against another company.

@3/ Are you mad? Even if Whyte guaranteed Ticketus personally, and we know how Whyte always tells the truth, where do you think he will get the cash from. Make no mistake Whyte has a case against Green and if he wins what will he sell to pay Ticketus. Go on have a guess.

@4 we don't care wer he's getting the money to pay ticketus they gave him that loan before he owned rangers so if he didn't have collateral to cover it then that's ticketus's fault for giving him a loan for something that wasn't his to sell

17 Jul 2013 11:52:43
It appears to me that many of you bears only want to concentrate on the negatives in everything going on at Ibrox right now, many seem to only too happy to adopt and promote any negative issue when sensationalized by others who are not rangers minded.
Let me clarify that I am in no doubt that we face a huge uphill struggle to balance our books as we make our way back to the top. There are many questions regarding ownership and other issues which require answers. There will inevitably be further major changes to the main shareholders and the boardroom in the near future and be in no doubt, there many people out there who would take great pleasure if RIFC fail.
You may think I am Greens biggest fan or whatever and I take every word as if it were the gospel, wrong, I only try and put a balanced view on some of the issues and recognize some of the positives which have happened since our darkest days
Take the sensational post yesterday that we have a joint venture with sports direct, this venture was public knowledge although the minutia of the details were not, Paddy helpfully copied and pasted a host of facts from a company statement and no doubt some dark blogsite. Reading all paddys facts however did not tell us very much other than how voting is carried out in the boardroom, we have a 1. 5 loan facility to draw on if required and some conditions to be applied if the loan is not repaid in full. Some of the comments from bears in response to that were surprising and no one even mentioned why this deal had to be put in place to secure a source of revenue for the club
Now think back, we had a previous deal with JJB who gave us 18m down and another 30m over a ten year contract to own our merchandising rights, everything with an RFC badge was to be sourced and sold by JJB from their shops which included the mega at ibrox.
That deal went out the window, we needed a replacement deal, how could a new company finance the set up a a network of shops, network of suppliers,, organize merchandising, new strip supplier and all other services previously provided by JJB,
Green and co knew this and after an initial 1m investment from Ashley, set up a joint venture with Sports direct called Rangers Retail Limited, already we see the positives, we own 50% of that company and all decisions made related with merchandising our products, we have a new strip from Puma, we have a network of stores including the new stores in the airport and Belfast, we now need to wait and see if this deal will replace or improve the revenue previously received from JJB. I doubt if this could have been in place quickly if we hadn't used a company with the resources of sports direct.

That's my balanced view of the deal we have, comments are welcome

JG

And that is a fair comment. I've no problem with scepticism with what's gone on but it does seem to be heavy on the scaremongering on here. Tbh we can scream and shout our diapleasures all we like, we don't have a say in it really. You pay your money to watch the team or pay your money to get a shirt. That's it.

Good post & I agree the negativity from some people is ridiculous but also after what the Fans & Club have gone through we are right to be suspicious. Coisty09

Sorry, JG, but I found the post to be long and boring but hardly sensational. Copied and pasted from a site that discusses shares and the market. The share split figures came from Companies House and, in my opinion, must have been released for a reason but I have no idea what the rules governing this are. The post wasn't meant as a gee-up or a put down, just some info in a very boring format that might be relevant and of interest to RIFC shareholders, many of whom use this forum. What it says to me is that Rangers have ceded financial control of an income stream and that they COULD be forced/bought out if they don't like the terms offered. That's it. No spin ;no gloating. Do something or do nothing - you choose.

Paddy Malarkey

Excellent post JG could not have put it better myself. So many on this board sucked in by the timmy trolls on this site who, s only objective is to spread negativity about Rangers to divide and unsettle the supporters. Yourself, Tommyblue and a few others put up good posts even Larky bear now and again. Others like Bay bear and his backup seem to be listening to the Kerrydale street accountants and doom merchants, who by the way got it wrong yet again (SFA to investigate Rangers takeover). Still I suppose if they are that easily fooled by the doom merchants they can not have much more positivity happening in there sad little lives.

Can only say, where are JJB now! A deal struck when they were past their prime and heavily in debt, and at a time when we were heavily in debt, total madness! And when it goes pear shaped green will long gone just like sdm, leaving us scratching our heads looking for somebody to blame. But then again if we bring our own saucers and cream buns another HERO will come along and pour us a nice wee cup of tea! I posted on here pleading that with greens past we should put him to the test with the share issue, ie time test by waiting at LEAST a full season, with full disclosure of ALL accounts letting us see that he can run the club responsibly with ticket sales, and merchandise etc alone. If you can't run the club in the 3rd div with that kind of money then alarm bells should be RINGING! Good supporters on hear MOANING aren't simply looking for a bone to chew, we are totally scunnard by the lack of concern for our club and how how easily we lie down to spivs who care not a jot. The Rangers support who are the life blood of our club, are having their amazing loyalty used against them, (as with sdm) this is not the Rangers way!

Aye Ready

Hi M8,, I agree too many are repesating the same warnings day after day, as if we don't already know not to trust Green etc, ( Larky please read and take on board the following)
we don't need a messiah to tell us daily that you don't trust Green, none of us trust Green m8, I said on here months ago we would be paying him for years to come, unless someone pays him off completely, you my friend tell us this every single day? WE don't Need you telling what you think of Green every day!. I know you are a good gers supporter and that you mean well, but ffs gies a break man, warning us all of your fears daily is doing nothing for morale
You also post good sensible words as well it must be said, but we know we can't trust some board members both past and present, at the moment we need to wait and see how Mr Mathers performs and how the team is playing, so please no more Green talk for a wee while eh?
rant over Tommyblue

It's human nature to look at the negatives of any situation. All it means is that the fans are genuinely worried about the club. Sweeping statements having a go at them is pointless

You raise some very good points as always JG & I am going to leave all Financial & Business posts to the smarter guys like yourself to the joy of most posters I'm sure. Everyone who uses the site regular knows I like to get involved in all types of convo not just doom & gloom. I just love the wee site & hearing the thoughts & views of my fellow Bears whether I agree or not I don't hammer everyone with Sarcasm like some. Just like to say though that my posts are my own opinion I'm my own man, I think for myself & I wear my heart on my sleeve whatever I've wrote is how I see it be it right or wrong. I certainly have not adopted my views from sensationalised non Rangers supporters posts. Anyway some more good stuff from yourself who I usually attend to agree with.

Larky Bear

PS Eds apologies if u got 2 half posts the same but different from this one I hit that silly post button by accident.

Tommy don't worry mate your post is well taken on board & I completely scunnered myself with it i'm DONE mate. There's just certain things posted that have triggered my worries the past week. Especially all these teams with Pandza & Moshni In them & then certain replies that refuel the fire. I've not trusted green a while but really only made my views totally clear in full the past week. It may have seemed a long week pal I'm going back to what I do best and that's support the team. Il keep my paranoid opinions to myself. I'm sincerely sorry if I've ruined anyone's fun on here with the way I went on I don't know why I felt the need to bore you with stuff you all clearly already know. Apoligies again good bears.

Go on the Cliftonville & welcome back Competitive Club Football sorely missed.

Larky Bear

@ JG of course you are right in pointing out all the good things that seem to be happening within the club, I admit that the contrast to this time last year is night and day. We seem to have secured what seems like some very good additions to the team, as you also say there is plenty to be upbeat about on the commercial side of things (ie the new retail outlets, shirt sponsorship the Puma deal) there will be others I have missed so your point is 100% spot on in that respect. These are all part of the reasons that I have renewed my season ticket and will purchase goods from club shops.
Everyone will have different opinions on this but I couldn't not renew. That said I'm not going to just sit back without asking some questions and just hoping everything will be sweet, we were promised transparency, but don't seen to have had much of that. I am still waiting on answers about the Murray to White sale, the way Duff and Phelps dicked us about then sold for a lower price, I don't need to go through it all as I know you are as aware of lack of clarity on the whole debacle.
I also admit that I don't know enough about company structures etc to make really informed decisions about what's going on there, but Paddy's post gave me some snippets of information that helps me understand some of it a bit more. I also use enough Internet forums to be able to spot trolling from all but the best of them, so I think that I can say that the won't make my mind up with posts on here.
So at the end of the day you are right about a lot of the negativity, but that's just because we couldn't take any more of last summers sh!t. Yes there seems to be loads to be positive about regarding Rangers, I'm just still a bit worried that its just a case of someone saying "look there's a squirrel" and everyone looks. Whilst in the other direction, who knows.
Anyway keep up your posts mate because they are always worth reading.

Fair enough JG, you've got a point and I accept I am one of the main instigators focusing on the negative on here. However in answer to #4 what backup? I would think 30k+season tickets sold vey much puts me in the minority don't you? I work alone mate, if some people agree with me fair play, but it's clear most do not.
The old Timmy sympathizer routine is getting a bit tired pal. How's about putting a name to your posts or do you not have the courage of your convictions?
Anyway JG, I'll tone down the negativity mate, I'm just finding it hard to buy into signings, new season etc as I'm concerned with the goings on in the background, that's all. I'll try to be more positive but will continue to push for answers.
Incidentally, we do agree on one thing "There are many questions regarding ownership and other issues which require answers"
Not trying to get a rise or anything but can I ask what you and others are actually doing to get these answers or are the majority just waiting for someone else to do it?
I'm not just moaning on here by the way. I've joined the RST like I said I would and I am actively trying to get them to push for answers. I have also written to he club and previously written to other governing bodies. So far the RST are he only ones who have responded and I respect them for at least having the courtesy to listen and reply.
I take exception to people questioning my loyalty to Rangers when I am actively trying to do something as an individual when it seems that most are doing nothing more than hoping all will be well.

If I'm totally wrong I'll be back on here to take my medicine. Equally I will highlight to some they have no right to complain if it all goes Pete Tong if they sat back and did nothing.

Baybear

Aye Ready, Alex Mci & Bay Bear you guys pretty much share my views exactly & manage to put them across so much better I go off course too much & start talking about irrelevant things like Walter & Ally. That really upsets some folk. This is why I am well & truly stepping down from my post as self appointed spokesperson for the Gloom Merchants for the month of July lol.

Larky Bear

When the money men have made their buck and moved on, what then? Sdm should have been looking out for the clubs long term health by inviting more Fan ownership, and not just to pay off his debts. That way when they do move on the supporters have a BIG say in the next step forward, and are not left with huge debts and made easy pickings for spivs. We deserve more respect than to be viewed as an just an asset to be bought and sold. I thought WE were the people? And other than relying on a kind hearted wealthy Ranger, is this not a positive and modern approach to who actually owns our Club? I don't understand why it's so low on the agenda after all that's happened to us, even the RST do little to challenge the current lack of transparency, yet the potential the Supporters have is enormous!

Aye Ready

ED, just a wee note to add that the RST have had a couple of POSITIVE (sorry couldn't resist lol) meetings this month regarding Fan ownership. And interestingly there were reps from several Scottish clubs present, that being their "supporters groups. " So a wee apology to the RST, but I still think the whole subject is neglected, and not promoted enough. personally I think we need a whole new model for the game. imho

Aye Ready

Lol Larkey- I'll have nobody claiming titles off me. I am chief spokesperson for the gloom merchants and don't you forget it!
Seriously though, I find your posts quite refreshing. I read them just like I was taking to a mate in the boozer. You're always happy to listen to the views of others and never seem to get irritated (unlike myself). Don't do yourself an injustice mate, we're all wanting a positive future for our club after all.
I'll try and moan a bit less too but I don't fancy my chances

V. Medrew

Me too Larkey, I think if peoples were to listen to what I had to say, ide probably go straight to the Doctors to get something for it! Nobody took me serious when I suggested a fund for the small creditors that got bumped, like the one's who were too small to absorb the costs, or weren't hedged. Charities and the likes also. Would have been a real nice touch, a decent gesture. It does get lonely sometimes but there's always V. Medrew around to compare my spelling mistakes with!

Aye Ready

@16 "I don't belieeeeeve it!". I'd hoped nobody would notice that.

Spelling and grammatical errors are another of my pet hates.
Along with fat birds in sandals and leggings. and those fleeces with native American designs favoured by the shop mobility squad. oh. and people loosing the ability to drive when they approach a mini roundabout. It's just a bl00dy roundabout, same rules apply people!. and. oh hang on, that's the men in white coats at the door!

17 Jul 2013 10:10:41
Here's a question for my fellow bears fans, as you know it looks very likely that rangers will be signing our ex striker kenny Miller for the 3 rd time, who would you prefer us to sign between nacho novo & kenny Miller, as both are very similar strikers and practically the same age?I personally prefer nacho novo, BIG RAM!

I'd rather we didn't waste money on theses signings.

I'm with you BIG RAM Novo all the way I believe hel be quicker & he plays for the shirt he loves Rangers more than any foreigner I've seen. Much cheaper option & I just don't feel Kenny deserves another chance no one should get 3 gos at Rangers & 1 with the Tic. Saying that I think we have enough clout upfront as it is, it would be a shame for Andy Little to get benched for anyone this season & I'd like to see Clark get a good run in the team to settle in.

Larky Bear

We do not need either of them.
There is enough ammo up front and we should be looking to off-load some of the current squad before signing any more players.
billyb

None of them actually. We are going backwards if we sign Miller. WW

Not sure at your position on this RAM but I don't think we should be going anywhere near either of them. That said, if I absolutely had to choose I would go for Miller. I just feel he has a better technical ability than wee Novo and would no doubt still be able to do a job at this level. Novo for me would be the choice to rally the troops but in terms of footballing ability I think there is more to Millers game than Novos.
All that said it is a backwards step signing any of them IMHO.

Miller is twice the player Novo is!

Don't see the value in either.

Miller if I had to choose.

Don't think well sign miller anyway.

Neither personally but IF we were to sign one I would say miller, I think he would score more playing off daly. I think we should be looking at 21-24 year old strikers who will develop and not lose pace/stamina over the next 2 seasons. I will support whoever is signed though.

DJ

@2, that's like saying nobody should be allowed to have 3 jobs in their lives?, god help us, and @6, totally agree, Miller is vastly superior player, and he also loves Rangers, if that's neccessary

Are you joking novo is a wee fat useless badge kisser. and miller well miller is the worst striker ever he wad a terrible scoring record and the rangers fans accepted it because he scored against Celtic. he was a little tango coloured mercenary who god knows got to play for celtic and rangers. he was a headless chicken and I could not stand the boy. shows you how good he ishe can't get a club for next season.

17 Jul 2013 15:44:33
I know we have fallen lower than any of us ever feared possible, but signing kenny miller again is a kick in the pride nuts that's down there with the worst of them. Novo no ta either.

17 Jul 2013 08:12:37
McCoist wants Kenny Miller back at Rangers and I hope he gets him. Good player for us.

Kenny Miller can go and rot in Hell he has now left us twice that is enough in anybodys book