Rangers Banter Archive May 29 2012

29 May 2012 23:35:12
of course the spl is rank ...we all know that but if you win this rank league then the door opens up to all kinds of wonderfull financial gains...otherwise there would be no greens and lawells for miles......greens ambition is to win the league at some time and rake in some cl dough....nae brainer right......just get over the hurdles wi some kind of integrity and off we go......look oot the dark side...were on the way back.....negative comments always welcome .....deecee

If you have such disdain for scottish football why do you support à team which has played in it for so long ? Go and get a train from glas. Central and go and watch rochdale or arsenal or even carlisle (1hr).

Might be because he lives in scotland and as us rangers fans are told quite often when questioning celtic supporters on this site everybody is intitled to there oppinion even you so swallow it or leave ya self...mark.

If rank league ,why boast about being most successful club in the world is thst because some other leagues are not as rank and therefore harder to win.
p.s. i must have missed when you won the big cup. haha

dinwar

29 May 2012 21:04:10
This is the information that was given to creditors today regarding what monies would be available to them under the various scenarios.
CVA £4.9 million
Newco £0.9 million
Liquidation £0

If Duff & Phelps are working on behalf of the creditors how can the available money for creditors be £0 if rangers are liquidated?

All assets of the club have a valuation, Ibrox, Murray Park, trophies, fixtures & fittings and after Friday 1st June all the players can be sold as the transfer window opens.

I am not an expert but a blind man can see that this would raise more cash for the creditors than either of the other options.

So Duff and Phelps do your job, liquidate the club and get the creditors the best return available to them.

I spoke to an insolvency practitioner today, he said that if the deal is done to sell everything for green for 5.5m in the event of CVA not approved then this cannot be broken and liquidation does indeed mean nothing for creditors, it appears to me the cva is a blinder, the only stumbling point is the open market value of the assets but that is so up for debate as to be impossible, i'm a Celtic fan but hand on heart it would seem impossible not to accept this CVA.
Nevis

Yes but does the rest of World football ever want to do business with this group again ?

2)
If there's money in it for them. YES

bil72

29 May 2012 20:14:39
Hats off to them, D&P and Green had a huge tactical win today. A few hours before the Court decision the long awaited CVA proposal is released,deflecting attention away from it's contents.What a coincidence. Green is buying the company for ££2 and providing an interest bearing loan at a rate not specified of £8.5m. To date Green has not provided these funds, and may never. If the CVA is not accepted Green has a right to puchase the assets for c£5m. The reduction being due to the players being free agents. Did the Blue Knights spend weeks and a large sum in fees and fail to come up with something better than Green's proposal?

Green is not buying rangers, he is a front for the SEVCO consortium

JG

29 May 2012 19:05:46
So the embargo should be lifted says the wise man!Because it wasnt in the list of possible sanctions!But did the Dunderheids at D&P realiize the other possible sanctions namely Suspension or Expulsion. Think EUFA are going to get involved no need for FIFA to get involved Eufa is more than capable! Out of the frying pan into the Fire Methinks

They won't expel. The punishment doesn't fit doesn't fit the crime.

Whatever action the SFA take UEFA will accept it.

TTG

Do you seriously think the SFA will expel Rangers from the SPL? No chance - they will have to try something else. They are in a catch 22 situation. There is nothing in their rules that will not cause a financial effect on the SFA/SPL in regard to punishing Rangers.

FIFA now involved. Want SFA to act quickly.

29 May 2012 18:07:31
Now that the transfer ban has been turnd around will the business man from Manchester from Charles green consortium come back to the table?

His only interest was in buying expensive players for rangers. So guess he's been on the phone all afternoon. Mike McDonald wasn't it?

No....because we will now have worse sanctions imposed than we already had.

1#Are you for real? His interest was buying players to sell on and he made cash from the sale.

@2. The only worse sanction is to ban us from the SPL, and they ain't gonna do that as it will hit their and others revenue stream that Rangers generate by participating in the SPL.

29 May 2012 17:03:29
Lets try and keep the situation simpleSir David Murray had to sell due to the fact if Rangers were liquidated he could not hold a directorship in any of the companys he owned.He would have lost all including his creditability no well run compnays would have wanted to deal with companys he was associated with. Now arrives Craig Whitesaying what he was going to do to harmonise the club in my opinion i think all who intend to asset strip and already a disgraced company director may have had nothing else on his mind. Low and behold he uses the Rangers fans money to buy their own club, i however believe his cv was aquired at a car boot sale.Anyone who has any business dealings with him should not be allowed near any thing rangers do.The e.b.t. scheme is within the tax laws except loans have to be paid back in the eyes of the taxman that is where the problem lies.It should be in the best intrests of the Rangers fans to have their own accountants looking for loopholes so that no persons from a vipers pit can out wit the PEOPLE. if there is know one fully commited to Glasgow Rangers now and in the future. Looking at the B.B.C report they are many questions to be answered and we should thank them for what they have done.Keep the Vipers away we can pick up anything like them on the soles of our shoes any day. While our hearts and souls will follow with pride forever and a day.

29 May 2012 16:22:09
Good to see Duff and Duffer are pocketing £5.5M for their efforts…..More than the other creditors! ….. Unbelievable!!

No they aint there getting 3mil

Heard on tonight's new-- only £3million left for creditors.D and P must be getting the rest----not a bad few month's wage.Creditors are left to stew as usual.These are the 'people' we feel sorry for

Its 4million as of today and counting,once again a keep yous informed,stevo

So it jumped up by 1 million since 3pm this afternoon. That's some calculator you have there stevo.

Read the bbc website and get your facts straight!! £5.5M owed to D&P through the CVA!! £5.5M FACT!!!!

I don't get my facts from the BBC website thank you very much. Have never found them a very reliable source of info. But you carry on!!

Administrators' own costs are subject to approval by creditors.

Ok let's try this another way then, it's clear your struggling! Duff & phelps very own statement regards the Cva proposal states they are due £5.5m..... Of course u must have a better source than d&f I take it?? Oh yeah and the bbc told u all the facts about Craig whyte not that long ago.... U didn't listen then either! Did u?

29 May 2012 15:52:20
Ed, The BBC are sitting on the phone hacking scandal as i write this. A celtic board member had his phone tapped by SDM although the BBC do not have enough evidance to prove this at present, they are however working round the clock to get the necessary proof to complete one of the biggest stories in Scottish football. I can assure you this is true as i work in media and have many contacts within both the BBC and other network organisations that have confirmed this. Watch this space and Mr Murray's day in court!

29 May 2012 16:37:21
My fellow bears what does everyone think about the possibility of taking Islam feruz on loan from chelsea? He clearly hated his time at Celtic and is needing first team football. Could be a great addition

Campsie Bear

You are welcome.A boy who thinks he is it already.

29 May 2012 16:30:51
Rangers win court case about transfer embargo - how will FIFA react? Could expel Rangers from League!
BBC NEWS

FIFA can do naff all, Rangers have proved that the punishment was not in the rule book, so more chance of SFA getting the wrath of UEFA and so they should as they are inept. {Ed039's Note - Fifa want something done, check this link http://goo.gl/wD0Cc )

@1: so the SFA may impose a sanction that was available - expulsion, suspension or termination of licence.

Should have been careful what you wished for.

Have checked post, nothing to worry about if they increase fine UEFA will be happy.

29 May 2012 16:22:09
Good to see Duff and Duffer are pocketing £5.5M for their efforts…..More than the other creditors! ….. Unbelievable!!

29 May 2012 16:25:34
Good news about the embargo, lets not get to carried away, we still cant sign anyone until were out of administration. But its a first step forward in a long time.

Das Shadow

So you think this is good. lets see what punishment rangers get now and who gets involved. more steps backward than forward.

" But its a first step forward in a long time"

Are you sure about that , Das ? If the tranfer embargo was to be lifted , another punishment has to be found . RFC could be slung out of one of the cups instead , affecting revenue , add that to the administration caused ban on signing players , the situation is then worse than it is under just the embargo .

However , none of it really matters . The CVA offer from Green is pathetic . For every 11 quid the creditors are owed , they are being offered a lousy quid . The PAYE & NIC debt to HMRC since Whyte arrived is nearly 22m , offering them 2m will be laughed at and followed by the "big tax case" demand

Liquidation beckons .......

jimi88

Explain how backwards?
SFA hit Rangers with the maximum fine, so cant hit them for more money, kick Rangers out of the Scottish Cup for x amount of years, if that happen's why didnt the SFA do that at the start.

Das Shadow

Again why didnt the SFA ban Rangers from the Scottish Cup in the first place if that was an option. Rangers have been punished with maximum fines.
If the SFA ban Rangers from the Scottish Cup it will be seen to be throwing the toys out the pram after be given into trouble. The SFA screwed up in the handling of this matter.

das shadow

@das

The SFA , in my opinion , decided on a more lenient option . Despite the wrong -doing , i can understand an RFC fan's rage at the embargo ,but , the club was banned from signing players anyway , through insolvency problems .
As for the fines , they were quite heavy fines too , they will never be paid though . Once Liquidation occurs , the SFA can't chase NEWCLUB for RFC fines .

Rangers will regret not accepting the punishment . Not only are they forcing the SFA to select one of the stated sanctions (suspension or expulsion) that hampers future revenues , they are throwing their toys out of the pram , with the knowledge that the SFA have future decisions to make regarding the clubs license and the dual contracts .

The SFA have been quite RFC friendly , so far , i don't think antagonising them is helping survival . I think you'll find the SFA blustering and stalling , waiting for Hector to step in and liquidate . Saves them getting blood on their hands .

jimi88

29 May 2012 16:12:23
No provision to hand down transfer embargo! Sky sports.

29 May 2012 16:00:38
from CVA doc just issued - see schedule 4

if CVA agreed and 8.3 M paid by green on time - creditors get 5M to share (Duffer gets about 5.5M!)

If newco - creditors get 900k (Duffers get 6.1 M)

If liqudation - creditors get 0 - Duffers get 6.1 M

unbelievable what Duffers taking out of this

AND - Greens money is just a loan - it all has to be paid back with interest.....

dont beleive me go and read it for yourself...

another dodgy loan for what....

The link would be handy.......

TTG

I have said from the start that Green is not putting his own money in. This gets worse.

Its the profit for the investors. They have to be guaranteed their return. CheltBlue

29 May 2012 14:41:14
I posted on here when Green was announced, asking how a CVA can be issued when the level of debt is unknown. Here we are with exactly that scenario.
It is incredible that the tribunal decision is not known yet, how long does it take to make a decision, this is now 5 months after the hearing, it is just unbelievable.
I wonder, although probably wishful thinking, that we have won the case and they want to get CVA accepted.

I find it astonishing that no pressure can be put on to get a decision.

So the CVA has been released. Seems to be a wooly document with a lot of unknowns. The pot includes virtual money. I suppose the money from player transfers is almost guaranteed, but the money from the law suit is far from guaranteed. In addition, the actual level of the debt is unknown due to the BTC. Just what has been sent out to the creditors to agree to?
Al

29 May 2012 13:03:48
if you think paul clark is telling the truth you must be off your heads this is just another divert tactic bbc got it bang on ,and if you think the tax man will take 20p in the pound yous are more stupid than we think ,d-p say with some rangers fans not them all just the dozy ok all of you that thats the best deal the tax man will get ,the only get is get a grip the tax man and tickettus will not except nothing but the lot and even in a new co they will still owe this money and tickettuss will still own the 3 years seats ,just a wee reminder how much are d-p on a week ,i cant beleive how gullible yous are ,the next tactic is to blame the tax man and ticktus for not accepting knowing yous will jump on board,how can everybody see whats going on except yous wake up ,jodrok

Unfortunately there is absolutly heehaw we rangers fans can do about it
just as weve had influence on what has gon on before
so you get a grip

1.) You are bang on, but remember all the Cellik fans are fully qualified tax inspectors AND accountants. In fact I do believe that most have PHD in these areas. So you can understand why they get frustrated by the likes of us down to earth Rangers men who don't claim to know what's going to happen next... poor souls that they are. You have to worry what they will do after this is all sorted out. And christ only knows what will happen to them if we come out of this in a healthy state...

BB

2# Not experts just able to use a PC and make informed decisions.You should try it can be very enlightening,maybie you might have saved this mess? who knows

29 May 2012 11:27:37
However, joint administrator Paul Clark revealed in an interview with BBC Scotland that they are still not in a position to confirm what percentage of payment they are offering creditors, and will not likely know until they are scheduled to vote on it on June 14. He still claimed it represented the "best deal for creditors".

Stv. June 14th ....

Hard for the creditors to agree when they don't know the deal.

29 May 2012 10:08:12
if rangers do survive this and exit administration via a cva. what is going to happen about pre season games we surely have to arrange games so that our players we do have left are fully tuned up for the season ahead. and all these rangers fans with negative comments regarding green give the guy a chance if he does not deliver then go after him. and having a go at duff and duffer does not help we need to wait till this mess is sorted out and then demand that an enquiry is held into their handling of this. another thing is there is strong rumours regarding david murray and his knighthood that he will be stripped of this and i firmly believe this will happen in due course. the future does not look bright at the moment but i am hopeful the cva will go through the bigger worry is the result of the pending tax case and also the ebt enquiry you have to wonder why the tax case is taking so long to be decided. or has it already been decided and is being hidden from the public for the moment. also ed what do you think will happen with rangers honestly. {Ed001's Note - I think there is now a very good chance of a CVA being accepted and the club moving forward in its current form. The value of the assets, without a football team to use them, is just not enough to bring in money. Yes, they are currently valued highly, but that is because they are being used by a football team. Without one to play in it, how much is Ibrox actually worth? Very little.}

@OP - pre season games are way down the list of priorities right now but if we are going to have them, lets have them all at Ibrox rather than abroad. Price the tickets realistically and bring in some much needed close season revenue for the club

JG

ED001; A bit of a falsehood regarding the value of ibrox.In its current form,yes it has little value.But when liquidators move in they work to a break up figure.Example; All materials that can be recycled,the seats in the stand being dismantled and sold off in lots or recycled,all structural steel can be stripped and sold on with all other metals of value.When you include the Marble and oak panelling inside ibrox,the contents of the trophy room and all fixtures and fittings on the office side and hospitality then the price might surprise you.Even the playing surface would be sold off,in foot square chunks to fans or as a whole pitch.Lob the albion and murray park and all of a sudden the value goes much higher in a break up.As an example,Possil School,which i worked on.was stripped and from the aluminium windows alone the demolishers made 24k {Ed001's Note - yes but it is nothing in comparison to the millions it is being valued at currently.}

29 May 2012 10:32:45
Green will be given time to raise the £8.5m required for the CVA pot but he has now convinced Duff and Phelps the cash is there to keep the club in business throughout June.

Today DR.

Im pig sick of this posturing, spin and lies and Im not even a Bear

So the money runs out before the season starts. This is getting beyond LOL territory.

Cucum bear

29 May 2012 09:12:11
A cunning plan even Baldrick would
be proud of. Does this 1 day delay
on sending out the CVA proposals
to the creditors which will result in a
forthcoming meeting on the 14th
June, when hopefully the green light
will be given to go forward with the
CVA will subsequently result in a 28 day
cooling off period which could mean
we could come out of administration
on the 12th of July !!

Dear me,i really hope your kidding.If not this country is doomed

Get a grip ya tube ! why strt brining that crap into even this situation.

Wibblyblue

Wrong anyway. 28 days period begins 16 days after offer. Even whyte wouldn't pull that one.

29 May 2012 01:50:33
If the big earners be sold we should swap with under 18s from the clubs that buy our players I think we wouldnt be breaking any rules if we lose the appeal all I would hope 4 them to allow us to get free agents just to give us a fighting chance. What u think Ed {Ed013's Note - It is an idea, but would clubs let their best U18's leave unless it was on loan? It could work though}

Surely when players have a set transfer price that will be activated if said amount is offered the selling club has very little if no negotiating clout?

I wonder just how good are the Huddersfield under 18's?

29 May 2012 00:08:48
Ticketus and HMRC will likely agree to CVA.
For the CVA to be presented to all creditors, talks are held with the largest creditors to ascertain viability of the CVA being acceptable to these parties, therefore more likely to be accepted by the majority creditors.

Only with the approval of these major creditors, will the CVA then be presented to all creditors which is where we are now.

So fellow Bears, keep calm, follow on.

Great theory,but illegal im afraid as all creditors receive the same treatment

Same treatment but 75% required to carry, which is just HMRC + Ticketus.

D&P cannot offer these two one deal and everyone else another.