Rangers Banter Archive June 29 2012

 

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29 Jun 2012 13:30:36
Ed can you clear up the score with this transfer embargo if we go down to the 1st will that still stand. I know we one the appeal but did it no have to go back to the sfa to decide what to do. Only so much punishment we can receive docked points fines removed from spl transfer embargo liquidated {Ed039's Note - Liquidation wasn't a punishment it was a consequence of poor financial management but I don't know about the embargo, it should be removed but I believe there will be other footballing sanctions)

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Lets clear one thing up here i am getting sick of people on here saying we have been punished enough u have not been punished once yet all the stuff that has happened is down 2 rangers no one else and all this the spl teams r out 2 get us is rubbish u were liqud which means u have no right 2 be put in any league so if i was running sevco i would feel dam lucky if we r any league this season because if sevco dont get in this season its all over

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The embargo was thrown out of court. no? we can sign anyone we like
But there's some other punishment due. I don't know when.

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29 Jun 2012 22:26:18
I'm getting the impression from the forums that green is quietly winning his war with the disbelievers ,the mischief makers and the press .

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So do I. We thought he would have walked away by now but he seems intent on getting the best for the club. Still don't really trust him but he seems to have some kind of a plan.

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He just needs to get rid of that idiot brown then , fly man smith and that pudding mccoist and he might have a chance . then he should sack sandy jardine and ev1 else connected with the old co , cos as long as there is anyone let you will always be known as cheaters

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29 Jun 2012 21:42:52
Im sick hearing about all the chairmen and teams wanting to put the 'boot in'. Sporting integrity they cry! All through last season im sure rangers only had 11 on the park. Financial mismanagement yes! Cheating no!
Thompson of dundee utd is a joke. Did he not propose a while back that when tge league splits the top half should be then played as a cup tournament. This was to give his team some a chance of winning.Even if they were 20 points behind the leaders. When rangers are in tge top division again we should put the boot in ourselves. Dont go to any away grounds. Just look after ourselves.

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Yet another sado post!Boots flying everywhere.The club has only itself to blame but you have to make scapegoats all over the place.Face up to your plight.No one else's fault--not D.Untited nor anyone else.Only Rangers.

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Those running the SFA, the SPL and the SFL are not Rangers (use it once) supporters they are charged with running Scottish Football and making it a vibrant product that attracts sponsers and investors. So when they say they £16 million will be lost if my team goes to Div 3, that is not a threat, that is reality. They are the one's crunching the numbers not the average fan or chairmen. Scottish football will suffer and not because I'm am a supporter but because of economics.

My teams average home attendance last year was more than Hearts, Hibs, Aberdeen, Dundee Utd and Motherwell put togeather. This doesn't make us great, it just makes us bigger. Add this to the viewing public around the world you have a the reason why SKY are involved.

I would like to go the Third Division and work our way up but this is were I have to laugh at integrity. Nearly every individual that has mentioned integrity has stated that my team would win this right away or it would stop their club from achieveing this. Self preservation is not a trait of integrity.

For example my team sitting with a 50000 seated stadium, a 14 million pound training ground and an the ability to bring TV rights to the 3rd Division would I think, be passed over for Spartens. Why?. Self preseveration and a witch hunt. Not sporting integrity.

When individuals are telling you that others will go into adminstration then it will happen. But heh who cares, as long as my teams okay. Sporting integrity and all that.

P.S Before some nugget rants and raves about did my team fans ever care think about this. If integrity is so important should others suffer because of us.

Scottish football is better without you, well see ?.

Never mind if it back fires watch chairmen blame the fans, consultation and all that. Method been used in politics for years.

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Call it what yo want. You can't have a situation where a club can re-invent itself and carry on where its predecessor left off. If all clubs did that nobody will ever deal with them (except cash-only deals) and Scottish football would be in an even worse state. The other clubs don't want this because they still want to borrow money etc. More financial integrity than sporting integrity.

The simple answer is that Rangers must move to the highest league division that will have them, and that's looking like SFL3. Clubs lose out either way.

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@1. Lets say your at work (if you have a job, and your not still at nursery) and you make a HUGE blunder. Is it your fault, or the company? The attempt at tarring everybody connected with Rangers with the same brush is becoming tiresome.

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To hell with rangers other clubs will survive in some form , some will prosper some will suffer so be it , rangers did wrong so they must go down . ps cmon the spartans hehe

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Some things just have to happen and clubs will just have to cut there cloth accordingly div 3 only option

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29 Jun 2012 19:47:06
Ok here's the way I see it. In the blue corner we have the Rangers men who say they know bad things about green, hint that they know bad things about green, or think they know bad things about green and his magical mystery men. In the Green corner we have MR Tranaparency who tells us nothing, contradicts himself, lies, and generally talks sh**e. Am I up to speed yet ?. ROUND 1..Green comes flying out his corner, and gets stuck in with a few hits under the belt, taking control of Rangers with YES borrowed money....Round 2...The Rangers men led by Walter come out fighting cautiously, throwing a few jabs before retreating...ROUND 3...Green comes out fighting, with a by gum lad here and a by gum lad there, but the fans are not buying that p***...Round 4..And the Rangers men, this time led by a clearly punch drunk Bomber brown, comes out jabbing, left hook, right hook. Have they got Green on the ropes ?.......F**k knows cause Brown wont tell us what he knows. The fight continues, sky wont show it, but I'll keep you updated. Basket-case.

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29 Jun 2012 18:37:17
Fellow Bears....on that day of high pantomime drama when the DR was full of McCoist to leave non-stories....I for one was not bothered by that revelation. I think it made perfect sense.

McCoist is not Green's man...and as many of us have said on here and elsewhere, McCost wasn't exactly covering himself in glory Long, long before Adminstration! 2 European Cup exits - the first being as instrumental in our fall into administration as CW's con of the century....out of two domestic cups to Falkirk and at home to DU....then of course losing a 12...or was it 15...point lead over CFC.

Since then sure McCoist has been good with the mess that has surrounded him although I still think he was out of order in his rant against the SFA and how he still plays the media when it suits him e.g. The dramatic exits out the front door for waiting photographers when he's not getting his own way.

For me McCoist will always be a playing legend but as a Manager he has fallen way, way short of the standards expected.

Given we are now facing D1 football next season...probably with a lot of youngsters...I think we need a new manager with experience of both that league and in coaching young payers. That league will NOT be easy to get out of.

For me I'd do whatever it took to get Terry Butcher in pace. He worked wonders with Motherwell and rebuilt that team from the ashes of their Administration.....he guided ICT back to the SPL from D1 in one
season and kept tem there....and also did very well coaching the Under 19's for a short while at DU. Add to that his connections to Rangers and for me he ticks every box!

We need experience to guide us through these dark days....and real experience on the football side when the paying squad us likely to be highly inexperienced. Add to the mix, every D1 team will be fired up to eat us!

So if I was Green, I WOULD sack McCoist and get in Butcher....he has the credentials for the job which is at hand.


Thoughts?

SPM

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Again SPM, a considered and,for me,accurate post..........green jhedi

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Terry Butcher manages a team in the SPL why would he leave to manage a Newco club who dont even know what Division (1 or 3) they'll be playing in , if any .

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Disagree, remember ally only had one season and at the start of it he got handed some dross in the shape of ortiz and others, he did a great job to get us through to the end of that season and should stay for now in my opinion

JG

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29 Jun 2012 18:32:30
With the way things are looking fellow bears I think we are in a losing battle, it looks like we are heading for the 3rd division, if we even get acceptance. The other clubs would rather allow Spartans into SFL than the Gers.

These clubs are going to suffer financially!!!

TTG

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The other clubs will

however the club the will suffer them most ...is ant newco with massive debts already an no cash ...yes you will have debts greens 8m right away

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Other clubs just want the exiting rules to be applied, because they feel that the SFA would do just that if it were a smaller club that got into this trouble. It's that simple. Its not hatred of Rangers. Its the whole principle of fairness under scrutiny. The SFA are trying to bend the rules for us and this is interpreted as favouritism.

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It is 100% favouritism dressed up as minimising commercial damage to the game, which is simply an unproven unquantified excuse.

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29 Jun 2012 18:22:07
"Sporting Integrity" I cannot believe what I am reading if its true, Dunfermline voting no to Rangers in the first division shouting about S.I, were the not the same that wanted reinstated in the SPL despite being relegated?
Anyone or team who uses this phrase cannot admit its all about money and self interest.
As for SPL clubs how many will we see in administration by the end of the season, they come out shouting about integrity and on the other hand claiming they will be in administration, effectively making the SPL a laughing stock. Get a grip FFS.

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I think most clubs will cut thier cloth accordingly when they find out the full exent of the financial implications of having integrity. this is something rangers failed to do when they went out of the champions league last year and have paid the price for not selling players to balance the books. if the other clubs dont learn lessons from this they will unfortunately but rightfully face financial hardship.

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There was a moronic idea at Rangers with Murray ensure and the board that they needed to give ally as best and most expensive team as possible for ally to win SPLs. Basically buying the SPL as tried and tested. Even in admin the focus was in keeping the team together for ally. Rangers could never afford this team.

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29 Jun 2012 18:13:43
I'm starting to come round to Green, he's right, too many Bravehearts giving a freedom speech but do nothing! I'm still cautious after Whyte but I'm going to give Green/Murray a chance
Dmrangers

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29 Jun 2012 18:01:39
Scottish football has too many teams in it, too many clubs fighting for too little money. With any great degree of recollection and consistency I started going in 1976 when I was 10. It was 10-14-14 at the time. We have added 4 more clubs since then, in a dwindling market? Great thinkers the Scottish football powers that be. Needless to say I think expansion therefore is madness but unfortunately it may just be the saviour of this particular fiasco.
SPL clubs look certain to deny Rangers entry into the division. Clubs in the lower leagues are increasingly against them parachuting into Division 1. The "integrity" of the SPL clubs should they try to enforce/sugarcoat that with an SPL 2 will be disastrous for the whole of Scottish football. Which leaves Division 3 with all its financial ramifications. Scotland's lowest division is the only fair punishment for Rangers, by some accounts 80% of their own fans favour this.
Will Rangers get the sufficient votes from lower league clubs to get Division 1 entry? This seems uncertain at the moment, a number of teams in that league are openly opposed to it and rightly so. Will they get sufficient support from Divisions 2 and 3? Karma has presented 5 lower teams in Scotland an opportunity to give Rangers a kick for their shameful efforts to boot them out in 1964. So I wouldn't hold my breath there either.
The SPL are terrified of having no Rangers in the top flight for three seasons, the lower clubs don't want them in Division 1. There may be a compromise however. Rangers fail to get lower league club support, therefore no Division 1, quite possibly no SFL entry at all. The league announce expansions and mergers whereby we have 12-16-16. The new division 2, the lowest league, gets an application from Rangers and another club wishing to join, by all accounts two non-league clubs have expressed interest only today. Rangers are effectively only 2 Divisions from the SPL. The problem with a 16 team league however is only 30 league games played, they currently play 36. Perhaps a sweetener for the lower clubs could be in slightly altering the current SPL format (which I hate incidentally) by dividing the league at the halfway point, making it a 44 game season but also giving teams in the top half four Rangers games during the campaign. This would be true of Division 1 also. At least two teams promoted to ensure no one suffers through Rangers inclusion and with all other things being equal Rangers perhaps back in the SPL after two seasons. Thoughts?
Gaz

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29 Jun 2012 17:58:07
if you look at the first players to jump ship,not the foregners,it has been the so called rangers fans,they do rangers out of a transfer fee pocket a big signing on fee.in a month or to they will be making even more money writing in the press how much they love rangers ,it would make you sick, W,W,T,P,

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29 Jun 2012 17:54:33
supers been very quiet since the cva was rejected ,for one who likes one liners he seems very quiet off late.....wonder if super is on green or browns side.surely hes not waiting to see who the owners will be before he reappears?is it all about self preservation for super?

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29 Jun 2012 17:14:14
typical englishman...slaggin braveheart....get oot noo...deecee

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29 Jun 2012 16:39:48
right ed celtic man here,ah no ah no,
let me just get ma tuppence worth in, firstly I think that this guy green has some b****cks askin for the supporters to pay ther money up front, who in they're right mind would pay for a product no knowin what league, what players ,what manager blah blah blah!
ok he says that IF the teams playing in another leagus he'll adjust the money accordingly,thats real big of him eh by how much £1,20,50 100?
thats like somebody sayin pay me the full price for the car in the windae n if ye dont like it bring it back n we'll chop somethinoff it TRUST ME ON THIS ONE?
so for whatever your reasons do not pay this chancer a penny, lets face it youve got him by the short n curlies ,
untill you know all the details dont touch him with the proverbial bargepole!
discuss

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Sounds like a Timmy comment - I should know.

Good Luck Good Bears

Gerry

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29 Jun 2012 15:33:17
Just read Green in the DR. I tell you what Bears if your not careful he might well just say @uck it and sell you off for a quick buck . Be careful what you wish for cause he's all you have.

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Exactly!

It's time for a leap of faith. Malcolm Murray has only spoken on a couple of occasions but I find him honest and refreshing. Green is more of a street fighter but that's what we need given the scale of the rebuilding.

I think rather than have "Rangers Men" in charge it may actually be wiser to have strong business men who can be objective and remove any emotion.

We MUST stop this in-fighting. John Brown is going to do more damage with his stupid ranting....I actually liked Green's Braveheart dig at Brown. It's time to go with Green.

We are all sceptical...we are all scarred...but we have to move FORWARD and start now backing Green.

Any one doubts this, read Malcolm Murray's statement from yesterday. He is answering the questions including naming all investors. It's time for a little trust Bears....otherwise the OP could be right! I don't think Green suffers fools gladly!

SPM

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I would rather the fans get behind Green than listen to the likes of that "intellectual" John Brown ---- the guy can barely string two words together.

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29 Jun 2012 14:53:10
ive just seen john browns 'speech' on you tube.the guy is a complete and utter embarrassment.not what rangers need.if rangers want to get out of this mess then they need to support this guy green.if you dont then there is a very real chance that rangers wont only not be playing anywhere but that the fans are going to lose ibrox and murray park because you havent backed this guy green and have left him with no choice but to sell, and not to the fans.

john brown is not the type of guy you want to pin your hopes on.ive got mates who dont trust anyone now but not everyone is a craig whyte!

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29 Jun 2012 14:43:53
I continue to be astonished by the audacity shown by the SPL member clubs,who sit in judgement of our club with their holier than thou attitude.Almost without exception these parasites increase prices for their home fixtures against us,now they dont want our money. Self preservation seems to have gone out of the window,the bottom six are perennial strugglers who,s balance sheets will have unpleasant reading next year.Our attendances at home represent more than than double all of the other SPL fixtures put together,how can a commercial business vote to half its customer base.People equal power so choose carefully SPL members, we have long memories.
Blue Boy 120

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Sporting integrity but it costs the old firm more money to watch these muppets at their grounds, and dont hit me with it cocts more for security etc that one dosn,t wash with me

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It's called for sporting integrity. RFC caused this, they can't be rewarded for their actions. Crime committed and there are a number of commercial victims.

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Simple.more fans= more police= more money spent=higher ticket prices !!

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Dear god,more thinly veiled threats.What do you want?Rules are rules,division three and build again.

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Bye then. Don't let the door hit your arses on the way out...

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Self Preservation is a double edged sword.

If the fans believe the game has become bent and corrupt and fixed to suit establishment clubs - they will stay at home anyway.

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When you rob a bank, you go to jail, you do not get to negotiate what YOU consider to be a reasonable sentence.

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You are indeed correct OP people equal power and given that most SPL clubs gave their fans an input in what to do with Rangers the people have spoken. With regards balance sheets that are unpleasant reading, do you recall Rangers last one, you know, the reason all this happened in the first place? That was the one with 276 creditors in it, had it slipped your mind?

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Rules are Rules??
You are obviously unaware that there are no rules pertaining to demotion from the SPL.
SPL and SFL are seperate entities.
The only options were to either remain in SPL or expulsion from Scottish football. The appelate committee decided this was too harsh.

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9# not relegation,liquidation calls for applying to the SFL for a place.

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29 Jun 2012 14:42:15
It is sad to see that many posters on here are so blinkered by hate toward players who have decided to do the right thing and walk away to protect their futures. It is one thing not paying for a season ticket but something quite different if you had to choose to risk everything that you had worked for all your life by staying with newco. A players playing days are short and I wish them nothing but success.

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Why pray tell me why you would be risking everything that you put into life, I don't bless a lot of people with the savvy to understand everything that's going on but don't start that rot, they did it for finance nothing more and good luck to them but don't make them out to be victims

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Might be short their career but look at the rewards that are there to be had ,enough money to retire for the rest of their lives if they invest the cash wisely ,well euro millions tonight is my only hope doug t.s.o

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Let's get something out in open when a player finishes playing (Football ) he can take up another line off work.They are well paid for playing football most of them.What most football players like us all to buy into they should all retire at 32/35years of age.Sure we all like to watch good footballers but let's get real greed is the motive.Im quiet willing to bet most supporters would swap there lifestyles for theirs.

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Classic example is david weir whom i take as a very sensible guy and gentleman .he has probably invested well in his career ,and at least had the balls to play on as long as possible doug t.s.o

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29 Jun 2012 14:35:33
Can anyone explain to me what this 'we want Rangers men running the club' is all about?

In the course of the 20 year meltdown virtually everyone in power have been 'Rangers men'

David Murray - Owner / Chairman
Walter Smith - Manager
Alex McLeish - Manager
Ally McCoist - Coach / Manager
John Greig - Director
Dave King - Director
Donald Findlay - Director
Campbell Ogilvie - Director
Martin Bain - Chief Exec
John McClelland - Chairman
Iain Durrant - Coach
John Brown - Coach / Scout

There hasn't exactly been a lack of Rangers men involved and they alleither didn' ask questions or turned a blind eye. Unfortunately the man who should be the rallying point for the fans, John Greig, is deeply tainted by his part in the financial scandal and was severely criticised in the independent investigation into the Whyte reign. So instead of anyone with substance you have a barely coherent, aggressive bore spouting rhetoric to try and fire up the masses. Who can step in and unite the fans?

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So what's your problem?
I'd have every one of them back bar Murray,McClelland and Bain.
The problem with your post is you included David Murray and left out Craig Whyte.
Neither of them were Rangers men,and that was proven by both their actions.
To the people who turned on John Greig hold your head in shame,you are a disgrace.
David Murray and MIH were solely responsible for Ebt and tax scandal,they handled the financial transactions through offshore accounts. A service by the way for which they took £6 million a year from Rangers! How the hell is John Greig responsible for that. If your boss offered you a bonus are you going to start questioning it? Gie's Peace!
Martin Bain could have and should have done more,but he didn't.
I assume by including DF you are referring to the eminent QC's choice of karaoke material at a private function?
It was a Rangers night, at a Rangers venue, attended by Rangers patrons.The fact that some daftie recorded it on his phone and put it into the public domain was unfortunate. There had been disagreements between Murray and DF for years,this only gave Murray an opportunity to get rid.
Did DF know about Ebt's? Don't know.
What i do know is that it was Murray and Whyte who finished us.. Nobody else!
P.O.B

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@POB: So sectarian singing is okay in your book so long as it is at a rangers night? I assume you feel the same about racism then? I used to respect your posts but it seems you have some hidden bigotry issues......green jhedi

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Ur an embarrassment P.O.B! U condone that sort off stuff then do u? Just cause it was a rangers nite! U should be ashamed off urself! The newco would be better off getting rid of the the bigoted fools like u! As for Donald Findlay, he's nothing more than a first class bigoted idiot like urself!

Byars

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I'm the OP and the reference to DF was nothing to do with sectarianism. The 2nd poster missed the whole point that all of these men held positions of responsibility and either didn't ask any questions or totally turned a blind eye. Whichever it was they all took money under false pretences as they did not do their jobs especially the directors. Also to just say its about EBT's is the kind of ignorance that saw Rangers aimlessly drift into liquidation. Add excessive debt, lack of corporate governance, accountability, collective decision making, deliberately misleading accounts (Ibrox £100m, really?). As for the comments on JG read the law lords report on the Whyte fiasco then tell me he's innocent. He knew about the wrongdoing and walked away to try and save his reputation rather than blow the whistle as he was morally and indeed legally obliged to.

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Sticks and stones GJ.
As usual you are very confused.
Where have i condoned anything to do with bigotry?
P.O.B.

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Disagree OP.
Martin Bain was the main man after Murray.
John Greig was a non executive directors.
This means that he was not involved at executive level.
The law lords report assumed that they must have known,it did not state categorically that they did. I would not classify walking away as an ally to saving his reputation. If...he was knowingly involved,then the records will show that.
JG may well have received bonus payments,so what. It's whether he knew about Murray's plans that's up for debate. I personally don't think that he did. It's all about opinions. Marin Bain squeaked when he should have shouted.
P.O.B.

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P.O.B. you're still not getting it, whether these guys knew they should've been asking questions and making it their business to find out. Graham Speirs wrote an article 10 years ago about David Murrays 'financial vandalism' at Rangers in wracking up crazy debt levels with no sustainable business model and no one batted an eyelid. None of the directors, including JG or DF, did their jobs and asked questions or voiced concerns. Google the whistle blowing act.

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29 Jun 2012 13:59:27
£8.7million off brown and consortium
£6.5million off the blue knights
£7.5million off smith and consortium
= £22.7million. if these so called carers of rangers put their bids together, rangers could be in hands of better owners.
greed is playing a big part in this and wont be sorted till either rangers go totally bust or these consortiums combine their strengths and money and do whats best for rangers and not their pockets.
frankiebhoy

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If they had banded together rangers would have avoided liquidation and emerged with the timeline unbroken. They all seem to want to be heroes using fans cash.

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Green to turn £5.5Million season ticket sales into £22 million. Nice work if you can get it.

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OP greed has played a part in it from the EBT stage.
Greed is npow playing a part in the SPL thinking, not survival but greed.
We all know that a combined consortium of all the bidders would be best, bringing different viewpoints and strengths but in any organisation it doesn't happen. Look at your mhob, why didn't the Kelly/Whyte dynasty just invite Fergus in earlier in their downfall? Remember Dempsey's shout 'the Rebels have won'

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Sound Business Practice is to make a profit. And not to make fans happy. Something Sir David Murray lost sight of very quickly.

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29 Jun 2012 13:07:49
If green needs the money from season tickets. Then why doesnt the man come out and explain who his backers are and what his plans are. I know many are refusing to buy them cause they dont know what league rangers will play in if any. But if Green came out and told the fans what they want to know them am sure he would get a lot more season tickets sold, however the last person that couldnt answer a question or lied when he did, well we know what happened there.
Don

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The chairman told you who the backers are yesterday, check the website for his statement.
We are going to have to put our faith in someone as the clock is ticking toward the final hour and we really only have one show in town, get behind green's consortium or walk away as others have done and watch us go t#ts up

JG

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I never said walk away, but as most fans are stating they are not going to hand their money out to someone that doesnt seem to be very open, his team seems to be very defensive, they attack back at people that claim certian things about them, instead of being ahead of these people and giving out answer. Thats what people are asking for straight clear answers. The fans have trusted a man before with their money and it didnt turn out well, so Green has to understand that people are apprehensive of him.
Don

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Every club in the world needs their fans money to run and to invest.Would Man Utd be there if there fans did not buy season tickets!!!The truth is he bought the club as a going concern wether Newco or Oldco it would still require the fans to dig deep.No one in World Football has A team with no fans but ploughs their own money in anyway.All the so called Rangers men who want the club would need season tickets to be bought or they would be in the same position as they do not have a magic tree that grows tenners.to sum up buy your season ticket support Green or we will be the ones that killed our club no one else.

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29 Jun 2012 13:05:16
This is my first attempt at posting on any of these sites, i have been reading the thousands of comments put on here for the last few months and i feel i have to say my bit ! when the club i have supported and loved for the past 40 years went into administration in february i was devastated , but the way the manager and the team stuck together and the way we the fans stuck together made as proud to be a rangers fan as i had ever been. During the process of administration there have been so many time and so many oppurtunities for the so called rangers men to step up to the plate and put there money where there over active mouths were and ye you guessed it ... not one of them did The only one to actually do this was our current owners and lets not kid ourselves these people have saved us from oblivion. i would say to all of the so called rangers men and potential investors who are now in my opinion doing more damage to our club than HMRC managed, to stop spouting utter s**te and dividing an already battle weary and frankly confused support and put there money where they say there heart is. I for one will follow my club wherever they end up wether its the 1st 2nd or 3rd division and i plead with ever other true rangers fan to do the same. Charles Green might not be the knight in shining blue armour we all hoped would save our club but he is the guy who has saved us. Lets stop trying to bite the hand that feeds us and get behind what is being achived so far at our great club ans start the rebuilding to get us back to where we belong ... the No 1 team in this country !....samson1912

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Well thoughtout post you are 100% correct.
Green /Murray have named their backers he has made it clear he is here for profit and that he will do a share issue that fans can be part of.
How is this not telling the story?
I have not held a season ticket for the last 3 years however I will be applying for one as I believe my club needs me and every other fan to do as much as we can so we are not the ones that kill our club by trying to score futile media points to have ago at the man who put his money whereis mouth was. Those turning their backs on the club are probably the same people who in the 80's did not bother to turn up until we were winning trophies again!

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Samson welcome and that was a good contribution for your first one, we need more guys like you on here who can see beyond all the abuse and propoganda that has been directed toward us for the last few months. we need to stick together. It was totally ridiculous that the day after the CVA was rejected we had a group come out the woodwork making noises about buying the club

JG

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@1 Well said mate, i dont live in scotland for the time being and gave up my season ticket when i left, I will buy one this year and let my supporters club and my friends back home use it in my absence

JG

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It's embarassing enough what's happened to Rangers,but all these so called Rangers men who have crawled out the woodwork are making me vomit.Do you think Charles Green is stupid enough to hand over Rangers and walk away with nothing ?He put his money up when no one else would,so it's his club till he says otherwise.Jealousy plays a large part in all this,The Blue Knights couldn't had had two pennies to rub together when you see how much the club was sold for.Give Mr Green a break and let's see what can be done.Also i would prefer Rangers to drop to the third division,and the rest of Scottish football can dine on "Honesty and Integrity" at the same table WATP.

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What harm did hmrc do to rangers? was it not the other way about.

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Please dont misunderstand my comment..i was referring to the damage caused by HMRC as a cosequence or our clubs actions. There is a saying that when youre in a hole throw the shovel out ! but as a whole we as a club seem to want to keep digging deeper, by that i mean the fans and the so called rangers men who seem hell bent on de-stabilising the platform we find ourselves on at the moment.As i said earlier i believe we truly were on the brink of oblivion but we now have the chance to rebuild our club. Wether we like it or not or wether we belive weve been harshly treated or not is irrelevant to be honest, we must get behind our club and get the best club in the land with the best supporters in the world back to where we belong.I like so many other rangers fans want a say in how our club is run but we need to firstly have a financially stable club. I say let Charles Green and his people steady the ship, take the punishment that comes our way and move forward from whatever division we end up in. "United we stand divided we fall" I just hope that the true rangers fans remember that.... thanks for the comments to my previous post it restores my faith in the fact there are rangers fans out there with the sense to look at the bigger picture......Samson1912

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29 Jun 2012 12:32:48
Couple of my twitter folk say that what Charles Green said to brown is

"Be Careful, I could turn this place to dust if I wanted to. It'll be a pile of rubble by the time I'm finishedwith it, and nobody's got the balls to do anything about it"

Whether this is true or not i am sceptical, however it came from Another site and another mate word for word and both don't tend to stir up sh*te.

This was in the context of

"Look whats happened so far and the fans did nothing, so whos going to stop me"

These are direct quotes...not from me but by others and is seriously doing the rounds on twitter...whats your opinion, Ed?
I was all for giving Green backing, but this (If its true, so far only rumour) scares me, if thats his attitude.

Rikkisixx {Ed039's Note -

Believable4 Unbelievable7

Sounds like Brown friendly people using smear tactics.If that was your plan would you tell brown anything? Remember the dingwall inspired Millar bashing? Seems like the same to me.

Agree7 Disagree3

Yup, good point Number 1) never actually thought of it that way. cheers.

Rikkisixx

Agree3 Disagree2

Could be smear and could be Green playing a blinder, using Browns love of the club to scare him into making a silly bid.

Right bomber, this is how much I want and if I don't get it, say goodbye to the club.

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29 Jun 2012 12:09:02
unless brown comes out and tell the bears what charles green said to him in that meeting he had on the friday afternoon that was meant to be so bad, then i am buying my season book for next season. get behind green now time to move on

Believable12 Unbelievable7

With regard to Mr Green's integrity. At least insist upon sight of the money in newco's bank account, for the capitalisation of the company.

Directors can approve that. If there are reasonable funds, obtain in writing, from the Directors, where the funds were derived from and in what form. i.e. share purchase or loans etc.

If the Directors refuse-you'll have your answer, bearing in mind company accounts are in the public domain. If they are still trading, they will have to produce accounts. That figure will be contained in such.

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Your Chairman has issued a statement which i thought cleared all this up.You try asking a company you have nothing to do with to show you there financials.I think the guy Murray seems to be a decent honest gers fan myself,and he has a good business track record.Has Brown?

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Aye and craig whyte said he was a life long Rangers fan! we dont need another one like him.

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29 Jun 2012 12:08:38
I find it amazing players such as Whitaker seeing lower league prem teams as a step up! Only in wages yes, but if you seek success and European football, Wolves, Stoke, Aston Villa isnt a very good choice.

Believable5 Unbelievable4

Nobody sees your performances up here everybody in the game sees your performances down there.

Agree2 Disagree2

We have to accept now that the 4/5 bigger leagues in Europe, and especially Spain and England, is where the cream of European football ply their trade. In my mind even the Europa and Champions League have been overtaken by the bigger leagues in Europe. UEFA had the chance years ago to prevent this from happening and money talked (just like in the SPL). The only way European football will ever gain the upper hand again will be if the big clubs get bored of their own leagues.
Either way the Championship and shortly Division 1 and 2 will be bigger leagues with better players than the SPL. The greed in the SPL has led to this from Setanta to the current debacle. Unless we follow the McLeish Report model Scottish Football is moving nowwhere but backwards. And while the Belgian and Dutch clubs can keep their youth before selling them on, soon all our best youth will all be playing in English youth systems unless we can persuade them there is something to stay for.

Agree3 Disagree0

With no Euro football as a lure,players will think the prem is the better option.

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@2 did you just mention "cream of european players" in a post about whittaker

JG

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29 Jun 2012 11:58:56
Green wants to sell off the remaining high earners to reduce the wage bill. He is worried that the rates bill of £95000 a month for Ibrox and Murray Park are too much for his consortium to handle. This will be made worse if Sevco are not admitted to the SPL. It is rumoured that Murray Park will also be sold for development as it's in prime land. Ibrox cannot be torn down as it's a listed building, or at least part of it is. Suggestions being made that Browns knows that Green is planning to sell the assets back to Whyte to make a fast buck as he cannot see Sevco ever being a profit making company with the outgoings it has at the moment.

Believable6 Unbelievable6

He'll struggel to sell murray park to a developer, can't build on that land, it's a green belt

Agree6 Disagree3

Murray park cannot be developed for housing!!

Agree3 Disagree0

Number 1) How did rangers build on it then?

Rikkisixx

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While Murray Park cant be developed as housing it can be developed as a leasure facility. This frequantly used as a way round green belt restrictions. So there could be a Golf Course and Club house, and Equestrian centre or even just a country club. Some time it is possible to create assocciated holiday accomodation. I'd say its an ideal spot. And unfortunately Murray Park actually sets a president for such a development type. If you think that planning regs are going to save your club then might I suggest your being a bit optimistic

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A 5 star hotel on the outskirts of glasgow with training facilities that are of top order. this will seduce other teams in uk and europe to come for a week stay during their break. this will make green more money than just lettin it rot away and not being able to build houses.
p.s, before you say you cant build on green belt, the building that is ALREADY there will be utilised and raised to 7 floors.
frankiebhoy

Agree3 Disagree1

Well celtic built on my birthplace lennoxtown hospital ,and 1st house i stayed in gallowgate looked right into their ground ,but i saw the light and followed the gers lol doug t.s.o

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29 Jun 2012 11:57:47
Team For Next Season

gk-alexander
lb-wallace
cb-perry
cb-goian or boca or new signing
rb-broadfoot
cm-hutton
cm-big jig
cm-bedoya or new signing
st-hemmings
st-kerkar
cf-little or new signing

this team would gain us promotion easy?

Believable10 Unbelievable18

29 Jun 2012 11:53:34
wonder were David Murray is now wonder if he cares one bit about what he,s done to Rangers the fans and Scottish football,he should be ran out of Scotland at told never to come back........les

Believable14 Unbelievable1

I think your confused; Craig Whyte is the man you should be shouting about.

GDog
RTID

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1#Murray must hold his hands up as well.He sold because he saw liquidation was coming,through his wild spending and bad stewardship.

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29 Jun 2012 11:48:14
SPL confirm today they can't "relegate" Rangers as per rules. July 4 'no' vote will see club expelled, newco left to apply SFL. The SFL trying to find a way, under SPL pressure, to put Rangers in the First Division.


Source: STV

Believable7 Unbelievable2

Not having written rules never stopped them previously, they can make up a new rule as they have been doing since february

JG

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So that means RFC (In Admin) will be expelled from SPL and cease to exist in Scottish football. SEVCO Scotland will apply to the SFL for new membership.

Well that deals with the question as to whether history is retained or not.

Agree2 Disagree0

29 Jun 2012 11:36:04
Nearly everyone and his dog (apart from a section of Rangers fans)
believes that Rangers should start in Div 3 next season.

Why can't the SFA accept this?

*** Self preservation *** is the real reason why

Where do the SFA get a big chunk of their funding from?

Answer: Corporate sponsorship.

Adidas, Specsavers, McDonalds, William Hill etc etc

The SFA fear that the sponsors will think they aren't getting
value for money due to lower attendances and will renegotiate deals.

Which burns a huge hole in the pockets of the SFA

Believable8 Unbelievable1

I dont think the SFA will decide what league we play in that will be SPL/SFL as for sponsors - they wont think they arent getting value for money - they will know they arent.
Sure kick us out the SPL but you know the consequences so dont cry about it

JG

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29 Jun 2012 11:21:32
The clubs that vote rangers out and saying they will boycott anybody who tried to vote them in will rangers fans give any spl team gate money when they get back in the spl or go to any Hamden games

Believable5 Unbelievable2

That will be sporting integrity taking away a democratic right to vote as you wish

JG

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29 Jun 2012 11:18:36
Paper talk today regarding sevco using auto season ticket renewal direct debit company. Fans complaining its a new club/ company and they need to sign off new authorisations, Green's club is not old Rangers, banking professionals backing this up.
Guess that means fans accept its a new club and there's no history. Can't have it both ways.

Believable10 Unbelievable4

WRONG!!

It has nothing to do with it being a new club. I am one of the supporters with a direct debit for a £500 season book who cancelled the direct debit as I ain't paying that much on a season book to watch 3rd division football!

It's probably best you get your facts right before you post!!

TTG

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It's a new company and the same club rocks for brains- how many times? It really isnae too difficult a concept I didn't imagine. I was wrong.

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@2 exactly, next they will be saying that ibrox has been transfered from PLC to Ltd therefore it has no history (much of it happy but some tragic) and was never built and rebuilt over the last 100 and odd years, i suppose the idiots will try and tell us that the next game there will not be counted in sequence but it will be the first game to be played at new ibrox

JG

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The club will reimburse you if we are in a different league.

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29 Jun 2012 11:08:48
AS a result of the changes at the club, there are new arrangements in place for the collection of season ticket Direct Debit payments.

All season tickets which were paid by Direct Debit last year were automatically lodged again as they are held in one batch. This does NOT take payment and merely sets up the instruction for the full batch.

As season holders have advised us that they wish to cancel their Direct Debit, their seat is cancelled in our ticketing system and when the payment instruction runs to take payment, all those who have advised the club of their wish to cancel will be excluded from the payment run.

Emails and web copy will be published today which advises season holders who paid by Direct Debit that the first payment will be taken on July 6.

Whilst we appreciate that this is far from an ideal situation, we hope that all our season ticket holders recognise the extreme circumstances under which we are currently operating and would ask for your continued patience.

Any season ticket holder seeking additional clarification should call Supporter Services on 0871 702 1972.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

29 Jun 2012 11:04:38
This is Not Banter ,but it is an honest look at ourselves (the fans), it probably wont get posted, c'est la vie.
A lot of comments on various web sites keep coming up with the question"Why are we the fans being punished , we've done nothing wrong" Are you sure?
We the Rangers support have an image problem, and to understand what is happening in scottish football at the moment we, as Rangers fans need to see ourselves as others see us,We come accross as being arrogant,bigoted , sectarian ,we respect nothing and no one who doesn't share our opinions, a part of our fan base have alchohol related problems, and seem to be in a time warp( they are still in the 19th century), the WATP syndrome is as out of date as slavery, the singing of sectarian songs shows a distinct lack of respect for others. So to survive this catastophy we not only need to change the way our club is run, but also the way we show our support for it.

Believable13 Unbelievable2

Lets all join the liberal party and wear flowers in our hair, need to be a colour that doesnt offend anyone though. Stop talking nonsense if you had gone to games in the 70's you would realise how much we have actually changed since those days. The problem with being succesful is that everyone else doesnt like you look at man u in england, it doesnt matter what we do we will offend someone look at the penny arcade and what they tried to do over that song, look at the sh#t over the colour of our socks all nonsense, just stop mate if you dont like it dont go back

JG

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Tip of the hat too you m8,if many others could only open there blinkered eyes up,have 2 brother in laws ,season ticket holders for ovr 20years& they have admitted its got far worse since admin started!!

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To No 1 don't worry I won't be going anywhere near Ibrox or anywhere else that welcomes that kind of "FAN",Last night's protest was enough to convince me

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@OP Very well put.If only more could think this way.Only comment---some are still in 17th century(1690)more the pity!We must change to survive in this modern era.@1--of course you can't please everyone but we don't need to be so vile.Change or fade away.

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29 Jun 2012 11:02:18
We should apply for 3rd Division and lets get started planning. All this other stuff is just delaying and confusing things. And look where that approach took us in May - where we should have been in February and a bill to D&P.

What happens after 2013-2014 season? Do we go back to where we are now as regards rules and regs?

Main reason for all this changing of rules etc is not to help Rangers, it is to keep all these governing bodies flush with cash to keep the w@nkers that run our game in "the fashion they have become accustomed".

Scotland has the same population as Yorkshire, yet they dont have 3 governing bodies of 42 pro teams. Sort it out. Now is the oportunity to follow McLeishes report.

Repeat - efforts are not to support Rangers in hour of need but to KEEP their cushy jobs and high wages.

Believable10 Unbelievable1

29 Jun 2012 10:51:55
Vote yes (if you have/or buying a season ticket under green)

Vote no (if you are waiting on a takeover)

Believable12 Unbelievable13

29 Jun 2012 10:31:54
anyone else noticed a direct debit for fastpay coming out of their accounts

Believable4 Unbelievable0

29 Jun 2012 10:21:01
Why dont we just donate our season ticket money into a secure account similar to "just giving" and then hand it over to a consortium chosen by the fans. This would account to around £14m and can be used by the new owners to get rid of Mr Green. Then as fans we will pay £10 at the gate to watch the home games. Granted it means that we are forking out a lot more money to go and watch but £10 every second week or so will not break the bank and it could mean a way forward for us all. This needs resolved pretty soon or there will be nothing left what so ever. What do you all think.

Believable2 Unbelievable6

29 Jun 2012 10:17:24
Makes good reading for those in denial!

Today is a black day in the history of Rangers Football Club and it is also a stain on the history of Scottish Football as the 140-year old institution comes to an end with the rejection of the CVA by creditors officially today. But with all the rhetoric of the titles from Rangers 1872 being transferred to Rangers 2012 - can the newco really claim these?
Two days ago Charles Green said: âœThe history of Rangers is not going to disappear just because HMRC decided to do an about-turn on what they have been suggesting over the last few weeks. This clubâ™s history and traditions are based around its fans, their support and their loyalty and weâ™re going to ensure the new structure preserves that.â

While Rangers manager Ally McCoist said back at the start of May: âœâ¦.make no mistake, we wouldnâ™t lose our history at all. We wouldnâ™t allow that to happen. If there is a team playing at Ibrox in blue shirts, itâ™s Rangers. I think Iâ™m right in saying we only became a plc in 1899, which was 27 years after we were formed. Nobody really recognises that change, but there have been changes all the way down the years. Rangers are Rangers and that would be the opinion of the vast majority of people.â

Now there has also been the peddling of the notion that Celtic should not be able to claim their history pre-Fergus McCann era because the Parkhead side named The Celtic Football and Athletic Company 1888 ended under the Canadianâ™s tenure. However it became a subsidiary of Celtic FC plc, that change in name also heralded the most successful share issue in British football history raising over £14 million. The club was re-branded and renamed Celtic Football Club plc. A massive difference from the saga surrounding Rangers Football Club 1872, whose timeline started in 1872 and was broken in 2012.

Some fans of the Rangers persuasion may think that Celticâ™s timeline was broken, but at no time did Celtic ever enter into administration or liquidation unlike Rangers, all that happened was a re-branding of a name nothing else.

Scottish football has a number of clubs who have ended up the same way as Rangers â“ going into liquidation and then being reborn as a newco â“ Airdrieonians, Gretna, Clydebank and Third Lanark.

Third Lanark went into liquidation in 1967 and has only re-emerged within Scottish football over the past few years. The current reincarnation of the Hi-hiâ™s cannot lay claim to the 15 trophies won by their fore bearers.

Likewise Clydebank formed in 1965 and went into liquidation in 2002, saw their history wiped out and consigned to history books, while they saw their registration bought over by Airdrie United under Jim Ballantyne after the Lanarkshire clubâ™s previous namesake Airdrieonians went bust.

Neither Airdrie United nor Clydebank lay claim to the titles of their forebearers, neither do Gretna 2008 whose previous namesake Gretna Football Club were liquidated in 2008 and reborn as Gretna FC 2008 Ltd.

Of those clubs that went into liquidation a total of 18 major trophies have been consigned to the history books and have been honourably laid to rest along with the defunct clubs.

So what makes Rangers so different? They arenâ™t.

They may have won significantly more trophies than those clubs listed above, they may have had a long and successful history but that has all ended in 2012 whether they like it or not.

THE Rangers Football Club 2012 has now been born and awaits acceptance of its bid to not only join the SFA but also the SPL. June 2012 is the formation date of the newco and it currently holds no titles and no honours. Fans of THE Rangers Football Club can no longer claim to follow the worldâ™s most successful club. The 54 championship titles, 33 Scottish Cups, 27 League Cups and the European Cup Winnerâ™s Cup are not the property of THE Rangers Football Club 2012, despite what Duff & Phelps, Charles Green and Ally McCoist peddle to the press, they belong to the now defunct Rangers Football Club 1872.

Former Rangers player Alex Rae commented this week in a column in the Daily Record, and is very apt: âœWe can now say that 140 years of history have effectively come to an end.â

Believable5 Unbelievable4

But will the penny finally drop& acceptance form all??everyone seems to have forgotton the biggest losers,the small buisnesses left going bust because of rfc!!!!!will be there legacy& forever rememerd,lest we forget!!!!!!

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28 Jun 2012 20:46:20
Ed- can rangers/newco replace players who leave the club with those who are out of contract at other clubs. {Ed039's Note - Depends on any sanctions attached to new rangers by sfa which has still to be decided)

Believable1 Unbelievable0

29 Jun 2012 08:35:51
if mr green want my money come out and give us some answers

Believable1 Unbelievable1

I think that depends on the questions being asked .but i do think you will get answers when the people responsible are brought to task .bdo and the courts maybe this year .

geo

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29 Jun 2012 07:39:49
hi ed, reced this txt from a work collegue whose cousin sent him this statement, his cousin was a well known business face in the motor industry and well in at ibrox. this is part of a conversation that charles green is rumoured to have said to john brown in their meeting, " i could turn this place to dust if i wanted to, it will be rubble by the time i am finished, and nobody has the balls to stop me " !! {Ed039's Note - sorry I doubt the conversation went that way)

Believable1 Unbelievable0

29 Jun 2012 01:24:42
Question for the Edd. With the talk of the Newco being paracuted into SFL1. Do the clubs bellow or in the same league not get a say. If you were a club trying to get promotion and a newco wes just floated in no questions asked i dont think id be happy. ........Craig Whites tissue {Ed039's Note - SFL member clubs get to vote on the proposals and it needs a majority vote to be approved)

Believable0 Unbelievable0

28 Jun 2012 21:09:38
Ed- when the players took a 75% wage cut was it not agreed that they could leave at the end of the season if another club met the transfer fee agreed by the administrators.Players who have come through youth development namely Ness,McCabe,and Fleck - are we due a fee? {Ed039's Note - No as technically the club that trained them no longer exists)

Believable2 Unbelievable0

Take your point Ed ..... Just a thought, could BDO not insist on a development fee on behalf of the oldco ? It would be some further payback to creditors

Agree0 Disagree0

29 Jun 2012 08:27:49
If a rehabed drug addict returned to their old haunts everyone would scream out FOOL. So why are we entertaining scottish football kicking us while down and laughing just for us to go back to the same old us then them situation. . I say ' lets up sticks and go . . England, Holland or . . . anywhere we improve and grow as a club . .

Believable6 Unbelievable5

What country would want you?And thats not forgetting UEFA rules that would stop it.Nonsense post.

Agree4 Disagree2

In the history of stupid, pointless analogies the OP definitely makes the podium.

Agree3 Disagree0

29 Jun 2012 07:18:54
all scottish clubs taking the morale high grond on rangers,trying there best to kick a biglub when they are down
there will come a time when these clubs will need rangers,i have no doubt about that
fans have long memorys
we wont fill your ground when you need cash
watp

Believable4 Unbelievable5

29 Jun 2012 07:01:15
This is my first attempt at posting on any of these sites, i have been reading the thousands of comments put on here for the last few months and i feel i have to say my bit ! when the club i have supported and loved for the past 40 years went into administration in february i was devastated , but the way the manager and the team stuck together and the way we the fans stuck together made as proud to be a rangers fan as i had ever been. During the process of administration there have been so many time and so many oppurtunities for the so called rangers men to step up to the plate and put there money where there over active mouths were and ye you guessed it ... not one of them did The only one to actually do this was our current owners and lets not kid ourselves these people have saved us from oblivion. i would say to all of the so called rangers men and potential investors who are now in my opinion doing more damage to our club than HMRC managed, to stop spouting utter s**te and dividing an already battle weary and frankly confused support and put there money where they say there heart is. I for one will follow my club wherever they end up wether its the 1st 2nd or 3rd division and i plead with ever other true rangers fan to do the same. Charles Green might not be the knight in shining blue armour we all hoped would save our club but he is the guy who has saved us. Lets stop trying to bite the hand that feeds us and get behind what is being achived so far at our great club ans start the rebuilding to get us back to where we belong ... the No 1 team in this country !!....samson1912

Believable4 Unbelievable3

29 Jun 2012 04:49:32
Why do these people who brown and smith are fronting for not just come out and speak to the media or the fans. I think they would get more respect if they came out and told everyone there plans instead of trying to get the fans on side by using ex legends. Never seen green using or trying to use any ex legends so who is the most honest him or the guys hiding behind the legends. Lets be honest they all had there chance to save rangers as we all knew them but they were nowhere to be seen so why trust them now because walter or john say so.

Believable4 Unbelievable1

29 Jun 2012 01:29:30
Ed can you clear this up.for me were rangers not members of the FA when.they played in the fa cup and if so would the oldco or poss even the newco not have a legitimate case to apply to enter the league setup in England? {Ed001's Note - give it a rest, UEFA have changed their rules since then, there is no legitimate case or Rangers and Celtic would have jumped ship years ago.}

Believable1 Unbelievable0

29 Jun 2012 01:24:58
Surely the clubs that makeup sfl1 would also populated spl2 and would still be against us getting a place and from now on I wish people would stop calling rangers and Celtic "the old firm" as I belieive this suggests the the clubs are old friends obviously not the newco but I don't want the team I support to be friends with anybody let all other clubs die if that's what's going to happen without the gers in spl bit I think the clubs will cut their cloth accordingly and survive bit it wouldn't bother me if any club apart from my own died which it did and broke my heart but I will follow the newco as I did the old and as I have always said as long as there's 11 guys that want to pull on a blue top and have a game of football there will always be a rangers as when you think about it and if you know the history of the club rangers were started by a few guys who just wanted to play football!!

Believable1 Unbelievable0

And were are we going to go if all other clubs die. jeezo

Agree1 Disagree0

29 Jun 2012 00:50:44
How much do you reckon the season tickets will be if we are in 1st division?

J

Believable1 Unbelievable1

29 Jun 2012 00:44:10
if green wants the fans to back him he needs to come out and say how much he is giving mccoist for new players and is he going to spend money upgrading stadium ect and does he plan to build anything on the land around ibrox we need these answers we aint fools we need proof of these things then we will back him

Believable3 Unbelievable2

29 Jun 2012 00:53:40
Am I the only Rangers fan who just wants us to be put down to the third division where we deserve to go and should go if Scottish football has any sense. Lets stick two fingers up to all the SPL clubs who wish to kick us when we are down, clubs who we the rangers fans - not their own fans - have kept going through the many years, when we paid the inflated ticket prices to go to their grounds. Lets take our punishment and come back stronger, we will be back and the league flag will unfurl at Ibrox again. The vultures may think now is the time to pounce, but we will have our victory in the long run.

Believable22 Unbelievable9

Can someone please take jardine 2 a dark room and explaine 2 him why rangers history stoped in 2012 and as for brown he is beyond help u have one guy with his head in the clouds and the other urging fans not 2 buy season books and boycott the club if sevco dont get in a league this season its all over. so good plan brown lets finish the club off i sujest what ever u and jardine have been sniffing just go away and sniff it somewere else and leave the technical stuff 2 people whith brains

Agree5 Disagree1

Ok we all want to start in div 3, but don't you think the other SPL teams have a valid point?

Agree1 Disagree1

I've said all along we should go to the 3rd Division. This carve up by the SFA/SPL/SFL is a disgrace. But when did they ever care about the fans ?

Denny Bear

Agree4 Disagree0

28 Jun 2012 23:40:48
WE HAVE CONSIDERED FIVE SCENARIOS

1.Rangers stay in SPL

2.Rangers to Third Division

3.Rangers to First Division

4.Rangers to SPL2

5.Rangers terminated or suspended

1. RANGERS STAY IN SPL

•Not an option

•SPL clubs have indicated no

2. RANGERS TO THIRD DIVISION

•Takes approximately £16 million out of the game

•Commercial partners walk away and seek compensation

•The settlement agreement becomes a major risk

•The sporting opportunity is quashed for other clubs

3. RANGERS TO FIRST DIVISION

•Reduces SPL income by approximately 30%

•Balances short term need for redemption with a least worst case financial scenario

•It is financially possible to recover from this scenario

4. RANGERS TO SPL2

•Currently not supported by the SFA

•Creates a bigger divide

•Leads to some short term commercial losses

•A legal challenge could paralyse the game

•The overall pot would be much less than anticipated

5. RANGERS TERMINATED OR SUSPENDED

•Complete financial meltdown

•Settlement agreement is obliterated

•Fans are lost to the game forever

•The game survives but where?

SO WHAT EXACTLY ARE WE BEING ASKED TO CONSIDER?

•Rangers in the IRN-BRU First Division this coming season

•A one off fee to buy out the Rangers media value. (£1million) thus protecting the current contracts in place.

IF WE AGREE THEN WE REQUIRE THE FOLLOWING

•Play-Offs immediately, based on our format

•A new distribution model with the settlement agreement value protected and future proofed

•An amalgamation of the SPL & SFL

•A more balanced governance model (as circulated)

WHICH WILL DELIVER BENEFITS TO THE SCOTTISH FOOTBALL LEAGUE

•Immediate cash benefit for all 30 clubs!

•Gate receipt uplift in Division 1

•Potential hospitality & advertising values increase

•Sponsors receive added value through additional exposure

•Scottish Government remain committed to our community strategy

•SFL has more influence at the top table

•Play-Offs restore the sporting meritocracy and deliver additional value

AND BENEFITS TO SCOTTISH FOOTBALL

•A unified plan presented to the Scottish footballing public which offers real possibilities for the game

•Keeps all 42 clubs together avoiding a divisive SPL2 split

•Deals with the need for sporting integrity with regard to Newco

•Delivers innovation in the form of a single league, Play-Offs and a pyramid plan

•Delivers new value for the game

•Potentially narrows the financial gap between Scottish Premier League & Scottish League

•Shows leadership for the game in Scotland

•Allows fans to engage in the bigger picture

•A positive media outcome
Related articles

SPL threaten breakaway second tier if clubs do not agree to Rangers plans
SFL clubs outline their positions on Rangers in the First Division
Scottish football chiefs move to 'relegate' Rangers into First Division

seems like the pennes starting to drop. cmon green take us to the 3rd division, if they can manage a year without us they can manage 3 and when were back we will remember those who kicked us when we were down and we will kick back twice as hard

watp

Believable10 Unbelievable14

While you are remembering" those who kicked you when you were down " Don't forget to spare a thought for all your creditors who lost money through no fault of their own Your arrogance never ceases to astound

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You were doing fine till your last paragraph. That attitude is why people don't like you.

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@2 as in the words of the song "we dont care"

JG

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28 Jun 2012 23:36:48
Makes good reading for those in denial!

Today is a black day in the history of Rangers Football Club and it is also a stain on the history of Scottish Football as the 140-year old institution comes to an end with the rejection of the CVA by creditors officially today. But with all the rhetoric of the titles from Rangers 1872 being transferred to Rangers 2012 - can the newco really claim these?
Two days ago Charles Green said: “The history of Rangers is not going to disappear just because HMRC decided to do an about-turn on what they have been suggesting over the last few weeks. This club’s history and traditions are based around its fans, their support and their loyalty and we’re going to ensure the new structure preserves that.”

While Rangers manager Ally McCoist said back at the start of May: “….make no mistake, we wouldn’t lose our history at all. We wouldn’t allow that to happen. If there is a team playing at Ibrox in blue shirts, it’s Rangers. I think I’m right in saying we only became a plc in 1899, which was 27 years after we were formed. Nobody really recognises that change, but there have been changes all the way down the years. Rangers are Rangers and that would be the opinion of the vast majority of people.”

Now there has also been the peddling of the notion that Celtic should not be able to claim their history pre-Fergus McCann era because the Parkhead side named The Celtic Football and Athletic Company 1888 ended under the Canadian’s tenure. However it became a subsidiary of Celtic FC plc, that change in name also heralded the most successful share issue in British football history raising over £14 million. The club was re-branded and renamed Celtic Football Club plc. A massive difference from the saga surrounding Rangers Football Club 1872, whose timeline started in 1872 and was broken in 2012.

Some fans of the Rangers persuasion may think that Celtic’s timeline was broken, but at no time did Celtic ever enter into administration or liquidation unlike Rangers, all that happened was a re-branding of a name nothing else.

Scottish football has a number of clubs who have ended up the same way as Rangers – going into liquidation and then being reborn as a newco – Airdrieonians, Gretna, Clydebank and Third Lanark.

Third Lanark went into liquidation in 1967 and has only re-emerged within Scottish football over the past few years. The current reincarnation of the Hi-hi’s cannot lay claim to the 15 trophies won by their fore bearers.

Likewise Clydebank formed in 1965 and went into liquidation in 2002, saw their history wiped out and consigned to history books, while they saw their registration bought over by Airdrie United under Jim Ballantyne after the Lanarkshire club’s previous namesake Airdrieonians went bust.

Neither Airdrie United nor Clydebank lay claim to the titles of their forebearers, neither do Gretna 2008 whose previous namesake Gretna Football Club were liquidated in 2008 and reborn as Gretna FC 2008 Ltd.

Of those clubs that went into liquidation a total of 18 major trophies have been consigned to the history books and have been honourably laid to rest along with the defunct clubs.

So what makes Rangers so different? They aren’t.

They may have won significantly more trophies than those clubs listed above, they may have had a long and successful history but that has all ended in 2012 whether they like it or not.

THE Rangers Football Club 2012 has now been born and awaits acceptance of its bid to not only join the SFA but also the SPL. June 2012 is the formation date of the newco and it currently holds no titles and no honours. Fans of THE Rangers Football Club can no longer claim to follow the world’s most successful club. The 54 championship titles, 33 Scottish Cups, 27 League Cups and the European Cup Winner’s Cup are not the property of THE Rangers Football Club 2012, despite what Duff & Phelps, Charles Green and Ally McCoist peddle to the press, they belong to the now defunct Rangers Football Club 1872.

Former Rangers player Alex Rae commented this week in a column in the Daily Record, and is very apt: “We can now say that 140 years of history have effectively come to an end.”

Briggs

Believable17 Unbelievable13

What part of the post do you disagree with? I really don't understand why you don't get this when it's there in black and white. Smith,Gough,gorum,Hatley and Rae to mention a few, have all said the club is dead aloandesite 140 years of history has been we top

Briggs

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If somebody did a straw and ear cleaner combo they would make a killing. You can clutch them while digging the sand outta your ears. R.I.P.G.E.R.S

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Any decent Rangers fan wouldn't want to keep their history anyway, I'm talking about football fans , not knuckle-draggers

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What happens to the club's history?
The Rangers Football Club PLC is a public limited company registered in Scotland (company number: SC004276) and was incorporated on 27 May, 1899. When the current company is officially liquidated, all of its corporate business history will come to an end.
When this happened to Airdrieonians in 2002, all of the trophies, titles and records associated with the club were discontinued and a new club, Airdrie United FC, took over. Airdrieonians' official history ended in 2002, then Airdrie United's took over.
The answer lies principally in the eye of the beholder. Some supporters will view the new Rangers as the same Rangers, while others will feel the old Rangers no longer exist.

There is your answer there Briggs, perhaps its time you accepted it is not fact either way.

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28 Jun 2012 23:30:42
been on quite a few football forums and it seems a lot of rangers fans would prefer to go down to div 3,after the demo last night and the demo at hampden should rangers fans now protest to the club about the possibility of going into div 1 and demand the club go to div 3 instead?are the fans just sabre rattling about div 3 because they thought rangers would end up there anyway?

Believable6 Unbelievable2

28 Jun 2012 23:16:18
Sandy Jardine made a point over the past few days that the players who have rejected the move to the 'newco', could have transferred and then requested a move (apparently what Ortiz has done) in line with their get out clause, giving Rangers a reduced fee, but have not done so out of greed or personal gain.
These are the people we should be venting our anger on, not the guys who have tried to take us out of the mess we were left in.
So far none of the 'Shame' have signed for another club. This would indicate that all of this free agent stuff is not as straight forward as they would like to think. Perhaps because whilst under contract to the 'oldco' Rangers they were not only employees but assets of the company and the 'newco' has purchased the assets of the 'oldco'.

BigGordi (Govan East Corner)

Believable2 Unbelievable10

A person can't be an asset. They call that slavery and it was abolished 200 years ago.

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Transfer window NOT open till !st July, that`s why they haven`t signed for anyone else!

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28 Jun 2012 22:54:41
So if this Division 1 proposal is sorted out soon surely our next priority is getting at least 5 or 6 players in before the season starts.

What does everyone think we will be looking at? League 2 in England standard players.

Believable3 Unbelievable5

I reckon we will stick with scots, maybe some decent level spl players.

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28 Jun 2012 22:51:19
surely rangers are due a compensation fee for mccabe , ness, fleck due to home grown youth rule ..like we had to pay aberdeen for aluko

Believable1 Unbelievable9

For gods sake man you are not rangers any more.rangers are being liquidated.. and aluko paid aberdeen out of his own pocket..shamrock

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Good if it happens. Then you can pay Hearts back for Wallace.

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What about Hearts being owed still?We need that money.Give us back the player then. {Ed039's Note - new proposals would see newco rangers take responsibility for footballing debts of oldco so you may still get payment)

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Nope. They were raised and trained by Old Co, shortly to be liquidated.

New Co Sevco 5088 has no claim on them because the refused to transfer their contacts from Old Co.

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What should have happened was that every single player should have been sold on and the money handed to creditors . Stop moaning thta you have been hard done too? its the poor fools who have not got their money that you should be thinking about.

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28 Jun 2012 22:50:58
Would like your opinion

how many owners do you think we
could have in the next say 5 years
cos every time we had a potential
owner fans backed them when
another bid came in they wanted
them then another and so on

now there is an owner (Granted
noone knows who) the fans want
others walter, boom
at this rate no person with the
money needed will want anything
to do with the club

WHAT HAPPEND TO LOLAYLTY
All fans care about is money
WHAT HAPPEND TO FAITH

this is why the club is in this mess
in the first place

the only criteria for these fans
is how much money u have

ive got one word

ASHAMED

Believable2 Unbelievable3

28 Jun 2012 22:45:39
On the brighter side of life Ally has got rid of some crap players hopefully he can pick some better ones now. I no we lost some good players but i think the true blue are left. This group of players are a real team and will play for each other no glory hunters now.

Believable4 Unbelievable6

No money from transfer fees to replace them either.

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28 Jun 2012 22:37:53
Whats evryone up to with Seasons books. I didnt realise there was an automatic withdrawl so I cancelled via email yesterday. Is anyone bought their book or are we all saying no?

Believable3 Unbelievable0

I think you'll find there will be over 20000 that re-new .....maybe 25000

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If it's direct debit it's been automatic re-newel for years now ..... If you cancel it's logged on he ticketing system and no payment will be taken on the 6th July when the 1st instalment is due

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