Rangers Banter Archive April 29 2012

29 Apr 2012 23:05:47
why all the doom and gloom everyone saying were going bust all of a sudden, TBK and BK have tomorrow aswell to get a revised and possible last bid in, its not over yet, i think its just a bad feeling all round cause it was such a miserable game today , i still think we will emerge from administration through a CVA, people are still forgetting, creditors will want some money rather than nothing, ticketus would prefer even 5 million rather than liquadation, the only main stumbling block for the club is the HMRC, but lets be honest....if they wanted us liquated, they would have done it by now, they know how an institution we are. Also Brian Kennedy if hes true to his word wont let us die in his own words, basically what D + P have said is they want TBK to revise their bid as they dont want to give it to the american as he obv wasnts to liquate and get the assets of rangedrs

'all of a sudden' ??


bill72

Sandheid. Anybody who thinks the bk can reach 12m is mad.

If we were having warm weather I'd be saying you had been in the sun too long....

Not accepting reality, head in the sand, denial, hubris thinking you're too big impossible, ..... Too late.

29 Apr 2012 21:37:48
if rangers fold and come back as a newco ally mccoist doesn't want to be manager!

Rubbish! He doesn't do walking away! Back to your own page Timmy, concentrate on your own team! lol

Miko x

29 Apr 2012 21:26:28
Is it tomorrow that the SPL report the results of its investigation and possible punishments?

1903

29 Apr 2012 21:20:44
Heads up Ed.

I posted quite a while ago that Sh* & Rangers holding company is el Gordo shopping centre dudes . . .

With a gate of nearly 60 thousand compared to the Mirren &Hibs laughable, if it wasn't such a tradegy, 3 thousand there shouldn't be much doubt that Scotland, never mind Celtic, need Rangers!

We are the People.

29 Apr 2012 21:11:54
Have to say nice to see the boy ness back,lets hope his injury stuff is behind him.Think sally missed a trick not playing him though as he done more when he came on than the rest put together.........green jhedi

Agree i like mccabe aswell maybe this under 18 signing thing might be a blessing in disguise p.s fair play g.j you deserved it..
craig+babybear

29 Apr 2012 20:49:26
I am afraid but I feel that the Blue Knights will be out of the running. I find it hard to accept that we will be in the hands of another unknown business man who cannot have any feelings for the club other than money.

Whilst Paul Murray was part of the old board and that is clearly a black mark against him, I don't think anybody could argue that he is clearly a Rangers man. He is also well respected in business. Disappointed that when they and Kennedy got together the bid is £5m. Was that not the bid before Kennedy?

They seem unable to place a bid that gives the chance of a CVA a chance. Their bid of £5m, even taking the BGT out of the equation gives 10p in the £. If we lose the tax case then this reduces to 5p. I don't think a CVA is possible at this figure. How do the 2 BKs think £5m is at all acceptable?

The Miller scheme is liquidation by another name, and I really feel that the American franchise system where teams can be moved from one city to another, means I think that the idea of closing a team is something that comes naturally to them. Whilst Ally seems to believe he had the best interests of the club at heart, I have sincere doubts. apparently so do Duff & Phelps, because if not why are they just not accepting the bid and getting on with it?

I feel the authorities will back down on the transfer sanctions as I believe that reality is beginning to sink in, lets not kid anybody on, without Rangers or Celtic, at least half the teams in the SPL will be in the same position as we are in six months - administration. We could easily have Rangers, Hearts, Dunfermline, Kilmarnock, Aberdeen etc etc in division 3 in a year.

I hope that we are not about to have CW mark 2, but I really fear the worst.

You mean if Rangers lose the appeal? Tax case was 'lost' a while back.

Great post mate agree 100% with you & your spot on the admin of other teams.

personally think murray has rangers at heart but money is the problem.there is next to nothing coming in & with the BTC due then its even harder to get any business man in talks with rangers.miller in my eyes will do a back door liquidation say he tried but fail then he holds the keys to ibrox etc & sells it. basicly another craig whyte,sees a window in what whytes trying to do but if whyte does it then hes a dead man.the top of scotland is only a few 100 miles away.if a yank does it then hes afew 1000 miles away.

if something isnt done soon (ie this week) then its bye bye.

lenny

Would the embargo apply to a newco? In which case, Miller's bid is "undeliverable"?

TBK & BK must have thought a £5m bid was capable of being considered? Or are they just wasting everyone's time? Do they believe Miller will walk away in the end up (like he has previous of doing), leaving TBK as the only show in town? If so, it's a decidedly risky strategy.

One thing's for sure, thing's need to happen pronto now. Administrators will be making a choice now. If it goes to MIller, and TBK and BK believe that would be a disaster as has been widely stated, it's hard to fathom how they couldn't muster more than £5m between them. Quite embarrassing, and a major let down.

29 Apr 2012 20:44:12
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but there's one thing I don't understand about Bill Miller's bid.

Bill Miller said that he prefers a New co. and to retain Rangers history - how is that possible? I thought liquidation meant no Rangers FC any more, and a New co starting with NO history. How can he start a New Co but keep the history?

Sorry if it seems a bit dense but if anyone has any answers I'd appreciate it. Cheers.

As I understand it a newco will buy Ibrox, Murray Park etc for £11.8m, which will allow money for the creditors. Depending on BTC they either do a CVA or liquidate. More likely liquidate. If a CVA agreed then Ibrox etc transferred back to Rangers. If not and a newco then they own Ibrox etc. I think

Rangers Football club and all its assets will be bought over by a new company the Rangers 1889 company will be liquidated not the Football club.

The Rangers company was not even formed till years after the Football club anyway so its a bit like saying Rangers are only 123 years old and not 140 years old.

Leeds utd did the exact say thing in 2007 and uefa still recognizes them as the same club. The Football club and the Corporate entity are not really the same thing.

The only difference in terms of the Football club would be which league it played in next season and that's about it.

@2 you are deluded,and Leeds Utd were never liquidated,so they didnt do the exact same thing in 2007.

@3 Leeds utd were liquidated in 2007 go on the companies house website and check it out or try this:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/2318216/Leeds-United-handed-15-point-deduction.html

Newco will buy club from Rangers plc. "Club" being the legal owner of the SPL share, rights to name etc.

Not so easy, though. Creditors (and HMRC in particular) may not believe newco is paying enough and force D&P to block the bid.

D&P work on behalf of the creditors, remember, otherwise a takeover would be as simple as buying shares from CW, which is what he is hoping for no doubt. The last thing CW wants is "his" assets sold on the cheap too. And £11m sounds cheap to me.

29 Apr 2012 20:02:55
Clock is now ticking down to our oblivion and a newco starting, didnt sir david murray say a few weeks ago that if he could help he would? Dig deep and put a good few million into the fighting fund which then can be passed onto the blue knights to save us from the mire.
watp

He gave it away so he didn't have to face the music, there is no chance of him coming back. Plus he doesn't have the funds available, he's rooked.

"sir" David Murray ...... Aka Judas. LB

The man who has to take a huge part of the blame for the current financial situation at the club will help to save it? Interesting theory.

1903

29 Apr 2012 18:57:47
If Sir? David Murray was duped by Craig Whyte, then he is just as much of an imposter as Whyte.

Here's a theory for you, and I'm open to ridicule here, what if the egotistical Sir? David Murray didn't want to take the club into administration, so decided to find someone else desperate enough to take the flack, as well as make a couple of quid in the process as an incentive......cue Craig Whyte??

It could be a bit far fetched however I'm sure you're all well aware of Celtic supporters and their conspiracy theories......dafties! lol

Miko x

Main poster - a bit far fetched? just about 3 months out of date. That one's been doing the rounds for months.

I don't really think that's up for debate, that's pretty much it. Lloyds called in the overdraft, Murray couldn't pay and Craig whyte had money (allegedly) in the bank. Murray deserted a sinking ship like a rat, and I was a staunch defender of him.

Oranjeboom

I think that was the plan from day 1. And I wouldn't be surprised if the blue knights were never going to buy us, just a publicity trick to get the bids coming in.

@3: I think many staunch defenders of SDM are reconsidering their opinions now.

1903

29 Apr 2012 18:53:12
Just a thought, if we do start over in the 3rd division with no debt, we play our young guys, perry, mcabe, ness and so on keep big lee and Healy ideal for the young guns to learn from in the 3rd and move up to the prem ASAP hopefully 3 seasons would that be bad?
No debt a young team that has grown together!!
Also without us the manky mob will have no compitition no big sponsor money and with the wages they are paying surly they will fall into debt!
Hope this will be a last option but we can come back stronger and better and richer and rise back to the top where we belong WATP

Trouble with that theory is that the players we have now would hardly be likely to want to play in the 3rd division, either existing 1st team or youth players. You would probably have to build a squad from the ground up.

Somewhere over the rainbow, bluebirds fly.

29 Apr 2012 18:19:10
I didn't think it was possible but without Steve Davis mo edu looked even worse than normal the guy is garbage.

Err not his best game ....... But the boy Bartley! Total stinker! Thought the ball boy behind Greegs goal played a blinder tho! LB

29 Apr 2012 18:03:58
Watched game on t.v and once again atmosphere looked second to none. As a Celtic supporter I don't want to see this fixture finished. Rangers supporters were brilliant and even though the ( no pope of Rome ) bile came out, overall it was a near faultless example from both sets of fans, a carnival of colour and chants of the biggest football game in the world. As a jersey resident now, trust me when I say people outside Scotland aren't bothered about our league and
Without this fixture Our league would have no audience further afield.

Agreed, would be a sad day to see the end of the Old Firm derby. Good result for Celtic, can't complain we could have lost by more. Hopefully we will still be around to play more games against you and get the result in our favour the next time.

29 Apr 2012 18:01:45
Now it looks like the American has won. It looks like a new co for us. That means the new strip and badge will have to be replaced. Do you think jjb are after one last payday.

Need to be crazy buying the new strip.

29 Apr 2012 17:09:01
just a little rumour that iv heard once or twice,,, in the summer of 2012 most big eanlers will be sold if demoted to the 3rd division or not with the exception os steven naismth considering that my team for next season would be


GK alexander
RB cole
CB perry
CB bocanegra
LB wallace

RM naismith
CM ness
CM mccabe
LM aluko (if given new deal)

ST little
ST k. naismith

ANY 1 agree??

HAMILTON LAD

If we are in division 3, boca, Wallace, naismith, Alexander, aluko will differently leave these guys are all way to good for division 3

That will not be the team if Rangers are in division 3.

Hamilton lad du honestly think these players will play in the 3rd division ???

what ave u been drinking the day i want some ??

.....but they don't do walking away.....I'm confused!

Wonder when McChins will walk away? Lenny's well got the measure of him, as he did Watty!

Miko x

29 Apr 2012 17:02:25
Just watching the second part of the SPL double bill. St Mirren scored...Blah Blah..... St Mirren had man sent off....Blah..Blah...There was more entertainment in Mcgregors save from Ledley than the whole of this match..I'm a Celtic suporter and we need Rangers next season. But to propose sanctions against other clubs because of your own misdemeanours is just wrong. Take your punishment but stay in the SPL. I'tle just be more sweeter when you beat us again.

You just dont get it do you. Why should we as fans or the team as players stay in SPL with massive over the top sanctions just so the money stays in the game. Come on put yourselves in our shoes and get real.

The sanctions weren't massive. But they could have been.

Celtic dont need rangers.

To those disagreeing with #2. Are you disagreeing with the first part or the second? The SFA could have thrown the club out of the league but didn't. A transfer embargo for a year is definitely not the worst that could have happened.

29 Apr 2012 16:30:26
Why should the Blue Knights and Mr Kennedy bid excessive amounts to cover other peoples actions?, surely the more they save on the bid the more they have to put into the Club. Call me a nutter but I'd rather see investment after the deal to cover Sir? David Murray's debt or Craig Shyte's not before! What these two men have done to the most successful Football Club and one of the most successful institutions in Scotland is criminal. No matter what Sir? David Murray done for us in the past, he has NO right to wipe out an institution of 140 years standing, NO right whatsoever!
Having said all that, if a Scotsman with Rangers leanings can do that to Rangers, what can an American with no ties except making some money do???

Fellow God fearing Rangers Minded Bears I fear the worst!

Please put this up Ed, the truth never hurt anyone!

Ritchie712

The administrators are supposed to be getting the best deal for the creditors. if they are prepared to accept such low bids with the value of rangers assets things must be very very bad. i believe people should pay their debts. the assets should be sold for that purpose and whoever can start a new rangers should do it as though they were completely new. if they want to buy back the assets, fine pay what they're worth. these adminisrators are baffling.

29 Apr 2012 16:25:08
Terrible performance today. bartley a shambles, aluko never in the game n in turn mcculloch didn't get the service he needed. celtic deserved the win so fair play to them. On a positive note good to see jamie ness back on the pitch.....a long time coming, hope he stays clear of injury as him n mccabe may very well be our best option in centre midfield next season.
J1985

Celtic always looked in control - our team were lost at sea. bartley is out his depth at a club our size never mind arsenal.

game passed us by, disappointed but not suprised lads

ryanrfc

Ryan a club of our size ??? our so-called big club is going doon the pan ya complete an utter nugget rangers/celtic aint big clubs anymore FACT


TB

You been sniffing lines off yur maws t1ts again?

rangers and celtic not big clubs?

TB away back ti yur sheltered housing ya muppet. you clearly have no clue about scottish football or football in general.



ryanrfc

29 Apr 2012 16:15:01
Clearly Celtic Were the better team but I'll give rangers the credit their due. Only player in the rangers team who done well was the big centre half boganea (sp) kinda pains me to say it but wish he was in the hoops shirt looked rangers best man most of the game.

Honest thoughts no fly digs nothing is today the last old firm game for a while ? Edd ? I personally hope not but starting to believe it was.

Thoughts ?

Lenny

Celtic were the better team, game passed us by, the only thing i can say is im impressed about mccabe and i was happy ness is back after a lengthy spell on the sidelines. izguirre ran the up and down the side all day.

definetly hope its not the last old firm game.

hearts say no, head is undecided. as we all know from previous experience that anything can and has happened.

ryanrfc

McCabe impressed u 2day ??? do u know anything about fitba ?? he an bartley worse 2 players on the park an it was all his fault for the 3rd goal think u need glasses mate pity u cant go to specsavers coz some gers fans boycotting them

29 Apr 2012 15:50:51
just got this off the rangers media site.
'
Posted Today, 02:33 PM
{Ed022's note - I have no interest in posting conspiracy propaganda.}

Good call Ed

"good call ED"
Listen to you ya wee soock. U don't even know what the guy tried to post.

It doesn't take a genius or a crystal ball - rangers media site & conspiracy ffs. Keep the crap away.

@2: we do - he tried to post conspiracy propaganda that the Ed. deemed unfit to post. Is there a problem with that?

Ed i think u r complete wrong not to post this it shd be up to us the fans bang out of order


TB {Ed001's Note - run along and play, the site is edited to stop stupidity like this. If you don't like, go somewhere else. The only person that is bang out of order is people like you, those who put their oars in and get involved in something that is none of their business.}

Well said Ed...ppl dont realise if it was'nt for you lot editing the post's the site would probably close down as i could imagine the post's that would be here.
pmttid.

29 Apr 2012 15:21:03
Correct be if im wrong but do duff and Phelps get paid their money from any investment put into the club if so that will be a substantial chunk of 11mil, or are they getting paid out of running costs if this is the case where is this coming from as I don't see any substantial cuts being made other than the players reduced wages which were supposed to be to allow no redundancies, have players wages been reduced to pay D&P

Craig whyte pays them lol.
Dtp89

Don't think so.

29 Apr 2012 14:59:22
oh its all gone quiet over here. thats why were champions GBNL

Away an chase urself where were u lot when killie pumped u where were u when hearts beat u.ok u won easily but were hardly on any great shape,enjoy ur day and a long and boring season nxt year without us your gradually gona decline along with the rest.ta ta and goodbye

When did Killie 'pump' Celtic? Today was an example of a team being pumped - the final was definitely not. And you say Lennon can't take defeat graciously!

You ARE the champions , we WERE the champions Dhimwit .

Celtic graceful & dignified....nah never gonna happen.

Quiet? Am just back from the game. The teddy bears were fkn bouncing all game pal.
Dtp89

You were getting the p1sh ripped out of you big time all game on and off the pitch.
wake up and smell the coffee. it's all real.

29 Apr 2012 14:42:47
After Rangers performance today, they will struggle in Division 3.

29 Apr 2012 12:33:50
I think that david murray is not the poor duped guy he is making out to be, yes I do believe that he knew exactly what was going on HE HAD TO! pleese dont tell me that a guy so well versed in business had NO IDEA what was happening to him re craig whyte, of course he did but knew the s**t was about to hit big time & needed a stooge, enter craigo> take the flack all the bad publicity etc then walk away from it with a nice wedge for himself, hey I would have done the same thing ITS JUST BUSINESS bears Im sorry but that's it in a nutshell, all of this " team he supported as a boy motherwell? yup wee craigo went in eyes wide open but so did murray whos the blamehound now?
marty

@ original post that's the gratitude you get from these arrogant fans who think their sinking ship of a club is invincible.

29 Apr 2012 10:41:10
This is an appeal to all fellow fans who want to do something at this awful time. It is time to ask for help . WE NEED to try and pay back some of the debt our club owes. STOP blaming everyone else its OUR problem now. I think we would find the rest of the world to be more sympathetic if we apologised to everyone our club cheated and if we started paying back every debt we can. We need to ask every player and ex player to donate something and have a huge auction, ask clubs if they will send a team to play a game at Ibrox, ask promotors to stage events at our ground, , anything! Then give the money to any creditor starting with the smallest debt, you know the little man who gets ignored during all this talk of millions, and most important of all apologise to each and every one of them for any misery our club has caused. Its time to stop behaving like spoilt children who's parents have lost their jobs and start trying to get back the respect our despicable directors have lost. If we are the people then we must act like the people.

You Sir are a credit to your club and fellow supporters. From a 'Tic supporter. Scott

Could start with the rfff paying off the small creditors up to say £1000


bill72

Well said. tic fan.

Small creditors are already being paid by individual fans & the fund. Please keep up.

Please keep up.? You bears stick together eh... Some fans have paid off some debts and all credit to them. What your man is suggesting is doing it in a more organised way. I'm sure he knows about the fans paying off some things . And what mate have you tried to do in a positive fashion for your club?

I am aware and very proud of the individuals who have paid out of their own pocket to clear debts. But this is a huge problem and requires a concerted effort. Imagine for a minute if Gazza, Gatusso Ally and Walter all gave up time to sit in the superstore signing our new football strips and we charged twenty pounds extra for debt repayment. How much would we raise? All I'm saying is we have a great product and these guys may have benefited from the less than ideal way we were paying wages, I'm sure they would help if only they were asked. It may sound simple but saying sorry may be the least our club should be doing instead of fighting everyone. Imagine for a minute how proud you would feel if the fans cleared all debts and left only the HMRC and Ticketus as creditors. We can do it, i watched 200000 fans find the money to travel to Manchester, If each of them donated twenty pounds I'm sure a lot of people could be paid and we might be able, no matter what happens, to hold our heads up high once again.

It is a magnificent idea, it is just a pity that the men who have the millions don't band together. There would be more money in the pot and until a share issue to the fans is achieved it would insure there would be no repeat of Murray/Whyte's wrong doings that has brought the club to its knees.

Tic fan

29 Apr 2012 09:15:35
I still cannot believe there are still rangers fans out there with Murray blinkers on. Look this is not a rumour but a fact.....the current situation is a direct result of how David Murray ran rangers football club! Craig whyte is the fall guy for Murrays bad management and soon to be proven illegal tax avoidance system. I urge all fans to stop blaming others and ask the media and powers that be to investigate all the years Murray was at the helm of the club.
Every man and his dog knew Craig whytes business history as an asset stripper but David Murray who operates in the business circle claims he had no idea of Craig's past! Blinkers off now please, if rangers go bust ( which is looking increasingly likely), one man caused this and for some very strange reason no one wants to hold him responsible. Get your heads out of the sand and demand that Murray answer the questions he doesn't want to be asked!

Every takeover situation sees businessmen carry out extremely detailed investigations on each other resulting in personal dossiers several inches thick. They put private investigators on each other to uncover every possible background check issue.
Murray knew everything about Whyte.
Is CW an SDM employee?
Is SDM to get a debt free newco with Ibrox and MP for a pound?

29 Apr 2012 07:28:05
Just want to say good luck to all the players today. Should this be our last game at Parkhead for a while then lets make it a great one and put our great club in the papers for all the right reasons. To the fans regardless how the game goes today make us proud' Rangers 'til I die.

29 Apr 2012 05:23:16
FINAL NAIL IN THE COFFIN fellow Bears.
HMRC can do no more deals:

Daily Telegraph: HMRC chairman Mike Clasper quits after tax-deal controversy

Mr Clasper is best known as the former chief executive of BAA.
Photo: TOM STOCKHILL
By James QuinnLast Updated: 9:10PM BST 28/04/2012
Mike Clasper is to stand down as chairman of HM Revenue & Customs after a spate of high-profile controversies surrounding the tax authority’s alleged close relationship with a number of large companies.

Mr Clasper, who took up the high-profile post in August 2008, is expected to leave the tax office by the end of the year.

A search for a replacement has begun, with headhunter Odgers Berndtson hired to find a replacement for the senior role. It comes after a series of bruising encounters for HMRC, which was slammed by the House of Commons public accounts committee (PAC) for concealing “sweetheart” deals with big business. The MPs criticised HMRC for deals with companies including Goldman Sachs and Vodafone, with the latter paying £1.25bn in tax amid accusations that it was “let off” as much as £8bn as a result of a deal.

Forget about CVA it's all
Or nothing.

29 Apr 2012 02:54:28
Ok Bears what's the score gonna be and who will score?

3-0
mulgrew
commons
hooper.

29 Apr 2012 01:21:21
There has been no Administration in UK football where the manager and his coaching staff have not been laid off. Can anyone explain why this didn't happen at Rangers? And of course all the managers loved their clubs and the fans etc...
Salary savings to pay back Creditors. The club has not been made more efficient to pay back creditors.

I think you'll find the salaries are the uneconomical part of the business. Main reason why we'll be playing the youth next year. Major cutbacks on playing staff but I look forward to a team of home grown heroes. CheltBlue

The club has to be kept as much as possible as a viable sale item so it's a very hard job juggling what to save here and spend there, think the wage cuts that have taking place would have helped , very hard to sell something if you remove everything inside which big Craig has done his best to do

The normal practice is to cut back and save salaries, which in addition makes the company more attractive to buyers.
There's still 180 people employed at Ibrox which is remarkable by any Administration standards.

29 Apr 2012 00:37:50
Another week goes by and we are no further forward, indeed given SFA punishment we are a few steps back. Don't know about you's fellow bears but TBK are beginning to totally piss me off now. They know what Millers offer is... So better it ffs. Murray said in interview on Friday that it is their final offer, now they are revising it. Am I the only one or does anyone else think there is something here that just doesn't add up. TBK just don't have the cash irrespective of their supposed combined wealth. I think our loyalty to them is blinding us from reality. Another issue that's always stuck in my throat is why would a Hibs supporting rugby fan be so upfront in all of this. Sorry but this is not washing with me anymore and it's going to be too late before we all realise.

Are you going to put in your money,,,,didnt think so,let the people that can have some chance of saving the club agree a deal.

Supporters have been ''duped'' - it already is too late!