Rangers Banter Archive November 21 2012

21 Nov 2012 21:49:39
Rangers didn't even have enough for the first instalment of the Ticketus money.
Spending money that wasn't there / there's to spend had caught up with rangers, loose the chip on your shoulders.
You can't alter history, rangers history has been concluded and rangers are now history.

You keep convincing yourself . Rangers are here always were always will be. Your hatred is eating you up. Now run along . Did you know hearts haven't paid there tax? How about you and your type have a go at running them out of town.

22 Nov 2012 00:06:03
2@3): Out standing they just can't help them selves!

Carling1873

21 Nov 2012 21:04:06
Hi ed. Am I right in thinking neither ally mccoist nor Walter smith benefited from an Ebt? {The Ed039's Note - Some people would like you to think so, but through all the digging, all the accusations, all the media frenzy, nobody has suggested and I dare say will suggest that they have been. So in a word, no)

That would be quite astonishing given everybody else appears to have been on them Ed. can you suggest any reasons why out of everyone they didn't have them? It appears quite incredulous. Do you know if either of them has been asked ? And whether they said no? {The Ed039's Note - Ally has definately been asked, and not EVERYBODY has been on them, is there evidence of something like 60 plus employees over a 10 year period? Lots more staff and players than that, actually hundreds more. If anybody can come to me with a shred of evidence that they received money this way, fair enough, but nobody can and I have looked myself for some)

Paper posted list of all players and ex-manager on ebts, these two did not appear.

One thing that has really concerned me through all of this is the issue of confidentiality, I would be horrified if details of loans I've had in the past became public knowledge - why should players be any different? It also now appears that most of the confidential details came from inside the HMRC - if so then that is completely reprehensible and should be investigated without delay.
JMG

To 3) but player contracts cant be secret in fitba, governing body must have copy to avoid shady practices, dems da rules

21 Nov 2012 18:46:17
In theory I could acquire the oldco for approximately £1, as a shareholder in the old company I have rights, one of which is to challenge the administration process in a court, because the oldco was not insolvent. The oldco and newco could then merge providing a bit of a headache for the SPL because they would have no right to have put us out the league, and to all the players like Naismith who would be owned by the merger company. {The Ed039's Note - And it would be spinned around in court for years before anything was determined and settled, lets just get on with it and look forward now, instead of ifs buts and maybes)

Oldco was not insolvent. Ha, ha - if that is the case why have they been liquidated.

It's time to move on, we won't forget what has transpired but we look forward now and get on with climbing up the leagues. bigbaz

To 1] You don't have a clue. Look at the figures, less tax and ticketus, and it was not insolvent. Poster 2 and the Ed are correct, we must move on, and you keep looking over the chip on your shoulder and you will see the big, bad blue ogre getting bigger and bigger.

Hi Ed while I agree with your note I feel we need some form of justice here.
We have been villified by all and sundry with no recource apart from bravado uptill now!
We should be at least putting pressure on SPHELL chairmen (cowards) to retract their statements about cheating and demanding the end of the Witch hunt that has been going on for months now with no substance apart from it might be true!!!!
If we were to match our attendances with belief we could probably rock some boats and shake some people out of their slumber to admitt wrongful persacution of our great club and at least stop the EBT Kangaroo court and lift the transfer embargo- I am not stupid and understand that the embargo was not as aresult of the BTC however we have been through a number of battles that would not have appeared if not for the BTC -I think they call it Karma or in the SPHELL sporting Integrity!East Bear

@1, have you had your head in the sand for the past 24 hours? With regards my OP ed I agree, just a hypothetical point.

Oldco in liquidation, not liquidated yet. way to go, bills (BDO's) to pay.

Oldco not liquidated bdo still to exhaust all avenues more execting now eh

21 Nov 2012 18:23:34
if sdm did nothing wrong and was confident of winning the case then why did he sell the club to whyte for a pound and if whyte was confident why did he put the club into liquidation ?? fact is the big tax case is irrelevant 20 million ticketus deal 14 million paye and all the other debt sold off media rights future season tickets the club was always going down

No SDM sold the club because MIH was in a lot of debt and Rangers was just gaining him bad PR through the bank running the club, which by the way they did to recoup some of MIH's £300 million worth of debt.

OP - Because you have debt does not mean you have to go down
The ticketus debt was an arrangement to be repaid over 3-4 years, that wiped out the 18M BOS debt
7M was debenture holders who would have held there debenture so no debt there,
there would therefore only have been the tax man and some small business debts left to square up.
tell me a football club that is not in debt, they are in the minority not the majority

But as the history books will tell us it was not to be, once the feeding frenzy began everyone wanted a piece of us and wanted to deliver the fatal blow but thankfully (for us) as the history books will also tell us, we survived

JG

What put Rangers into Administration was the expensive Directors and Players wage bills and benefits which needed an extra £20m income from champions league group stage every year. When the team lost, Whyte withheld the PAYE to pay the monthly wages.

Whyte was always the fall guy. For whom? murray or green!

21 Nov 2012 17:13:18
To all you tims out there, helicopter Sunday stays in the history books, GET OVER IT. Ha.

.......or will it? Ha

Miko x

So if the tax bill is minimal will the newco or oldco now pay the bill thats still outstanding on top of the 14 million from last year or will you continue to be tax cheats ?? its only the amount thats changed doesn't change the fact your still cheats thou {The Ed039's Note - Can you not read properly?)

@2. Please direct your comments to CW, Rangers fans were not the Tax cheats. Please remember this the next time you type with your cloven hoofs.

@1 & 2 dry your eyes ladies, If Carlsberg did Tuesdays, they couldnae beat yesterday!

@ 3 ill direct my questions to rangers as a club not an individual its the club that will be liquidated not cw

Just remember helicopter is still history but not yours you are a newco! {The Ed039's Note - I am still the same person, and I can tell you, it was fun)

21 Nov 2012 14:51:10
Just a thought edd but after DiStefano's ramblings a while back is it a forgone conclusion that "old-co" will in fact be liquidated or can a shareholder still have the chance to pay off debts etc. to "save" the company? In reflection the ammount owed is £90million lighter? Maybe an accountant from the dark side could advise? CheltBlue {The Ed039's Note - I think it would be a legal matter as it has gone passed the point of the CVA being rejected, I dont know if they can go round that again? I am sure these can be reversed, but how, I dont know, although any possibility of recovering more money for creditors can not be rejected by liquidators. Anybody who would be willing to buy oldco would also have to be willing to but newco as well though, and merge them like Bill Miller proposed, as oldco have no assets, ie no stadium, no players etc as they were bought by Charlie Green)

If bdo reverse decision, newco would not be involved as they would not own anything and just get thier money back.....

but one fly in ointment would be 'rangers retail' and other similar new business ventures, as oldco would not necessarily own these.....

becomes can of worms....

90 lighter maybe, but the club still owes over 40 mill inc whytes no tax payments and also remember ticketus, thier deal was with the old co

@2 - The club do not owe over 40 Million, Oldco were liquidated. You can't tell us we have no history as we're a new Rangers, then say you still have to pay the Oldco's bills. {The Ed039's Note - I have been saying this for months, cant be both ways I am afraid)

So if people can't have it both ways, tell me which way you want to go and I'll honour that.

OP - i know Giovanni Di Stefano is a bit harem scarem to say the least but i read that Di Stefano was going to start a new legal action to return £40 million that was stolen from Rangers.

http://www.onlinepublishingcompany.info/content/read_more/complexInfobox/site_news/infobox/elements/template/default/active_id/2098

21 Nov 2012 16:22:43
Rangers accepted that tax was payable in respect of over 30 EBTs and as such the FTTT did not consider them.

If these 30+ cases relate to footballers who had side letters and Rangers are admitting they are contractural payments (which they are as tax was payable), then this is damming evidence against Rangers in the SPL investigation.

After telling Celtic they didn't have a case over the wee Brazilian rangers shouldn't have a case to answer, rangers won the tax case, get over it, if SPL charges rangers now I for 1 will never goto another SPL game, rangers are not guilty.

Titles will be stripped, the case of Gavin Rae makes that a certainty.
It is going to be so amusing to watch the reaction of the same people who have hailed the judgement from the FTTT, that judgement makes the SPL case watertight! {The Ed039's Note - How do you figure that?)

YESTERDAY'S EBT ruling in favour of Rangers could now impact on the SPL's investigation into alleged use of dual contracts.
The game's top flight have appointed an independent commission headed by Lord Nimmo Smith and the outcome of his deliberations may lead to Rangers' title wins being erased from the records.

What was the total amount you lot said it was owed? £140,000,0000,0000,0000 I actually lost count at one point. And that was just the wee tax case!

I believe the figure your looking for is estimated at 2million. And that's for a 12 year period, IF liability is confirmed.

Still think that warrants your hatred towards our club?

@2. I take it you were one of the "youse are guilty of EBT cheating" brigade who had already pre-determined a negative outcome towards Rangers? Away back to the rubber room you came from.

At least 20 mill in unpaid tax and interst from whytes rain, 24 mill to ticketus.

reaching 50 mill, you tool

@6. Oldco was liable for any monies. CW is guilty for that. Please keep clutching at straws, it gives the rest of us some amusement.

Ticketus are going after craig sh*te for thier money remember? but your probably one of the rangers owe 150 million brigade. oh and unless im mistaken rangers owed around 9 mil in unpaid tax when they entered admin...mark.

At 7, read 4 and you will se the point i was arguing, 4 is stating debt was now only 2 mill for oldco, i was advsing regardless of yesterdays result the debt of old co is still around the 40 mill mark.

14 mill with interest, 24 to ticketus, 2.9 on small tax case and the rest of the small companies they owe.

clutching at straws, correct me if im wrong but are the rangers not 3 division below celtic with no european footbal for 3 years and a very average sqaud.

clutching at straws, of course. wonder what january will bring with the share issue.

@10

What point are you trying to make?

We are in sfl3, what does that have to do with anything? Average squad?- obviously high earners had to be shifted, really can not work out what you are getting at.

@6&9 You have a cheek to call anybody a tool!

The OP is only talking about EBT'S! And "IF" there is a bill, it is estimated at 2 mill fact! For which Rangers are not liable, it will be the recipients.

Your accusations are starting to swallow you up!

21 Nov 2012 16:07:15
Did Rangers players and their agents agreed prior to signing contracts say how much to be payed through ebt's ?

i think they call this contract talks

side contracts, dual contracts lets see what the spl's prima facia case says then we can all put this to bed .

All this is just bad management not producing the side letters to reflect the loans to the spl . my thinking is that this all could have been avoided if managed correctly and possibly preventing the old company being liquidated . geo

Was there interest added on these loans?

21 Nov 2012 14:12:12
After the verdict yesterday I'm sure like most supporters, my overall feeling is one of bewilderment.

No matter the result, they have all still won.

We should never forget, but our resurgence will be even more sweeter.

Unfortunately we have been reformed as a newco and now play in the 3rd Division, the result will not change that outcome. It's a bittersweet moment for the fans especially, whom several of them on here over the last few months have countered claims that we were already guilty (Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?). Certain elements (you know who you are) had already judged and convicted, then sentenced us before the result was announced. Bet they feel foolish now, i doubt any of them will have the baws to come on here and say 'we apologise for falsely accusing your club of cheating whilst using EBTs. No i think not, they will try further spinning the story to make it fit their own bigoted agenda. As i said, it will not affect our current dilemma, all we can do is to pack out Ibrox every home game to the rafters and cheer our team on. The haters have damaged us but not defeated us - we will come back stronger than ever. Rangers then, now, forever. bigbaz

Bigbaz,

It is a different mentality you are dealing with, with some of the regular posters on here. They won t feel foolish at all, they will know they were in the wrong and extremely prejudicial and judgemental, but they will just come out and say they were not really bothered.

@2. Yes mate, it's a pity at least one person who condemned us prior to the EBT decision, does not have the decency to say that we are not cheats. I would have some respect for them if they did, but here's hoping. bigbaz

No chance Bigbaz - they achieved what they set out to do and nearly destroyed our club, they did it by using the media and social websites, they knew they were wrong but that doesn't matter as the agenda was to destroy us by any means and make no mistake someone from inside the HMRC was driving this and putting out misleading one sided information to the media.
They got what they wanted why would they apologise?
JMG

21 Nov 2012 13:03:06
HMRC should be ashamed of what they have done to Glasgow Rangers. Seemingly they knew that the club had won the tax case on JANUARY 18th, 2012 and didn't notify them until yesterday, whereupon administration (followed by liquidation) could have been averted in February, of this year.

How could HRMC know in january, this was independant judiciary panel, who took 30 days after last meeting, to come to final decision ?

Also HRMC and Rangers told of decision 5 days in advance of publication, at least, and longer if redactions applied (Mr red, Mr green, Mr Blue.... etc etc etc)....

wishful thinking....

If that is the case it's bloody shocking to leave us hanging in limbo all this time, but can't help but think it was because Craig Whyte was at the helm. He's turned HMRC over more times than tongues can tell and that has a lot to do with their stalling tactics. They wanted to make sure he was right out the picture before this was made public.
SCM

Murray gets £6 million from ebt, not from rangers of course, not a penny from them, but from trust.

And then pays £5 million in legal fees to prove no major illegality.

If MIH used ebts, then those are no in the majority clear of any tax bill - so murray the big winner.

Now with all his money will he, repay rangers creditors and shareholders.. or walk away.

How did HMRC stall , they presented a bill and wanted paying ?

Who asked for FTT, who asked for redaction of the result to protect those given evidence (from what if not illegal?).... rangers management put in all the delays.

4.) WHIT!?!

So if the Bru ask you for half your giro back, you'll just nip back down the job center and hand it over, no questions no delay? eedjit!

BB

21 Nov 2012 12:20:46
I'm reading in some papers that people who have been using twitter and other sites to slate rangers as cheats may now be sued would be a big task but even if a few of these people are made an example off it would be good and maybe shut these people up once and for all

Carrying on from the lord Macalpine story last week. People need to be a little bit more careful these days.

There is a certain blog that might be in a bit of bother.

Aye that would be Phil magobin.

21 Nov 2012 12:08:16
Ibrox is going to be a great place to be the next 2/3 years fight to the top the whole cheating thing was a real mill stone round our necks, really looking forward to singing Sandy, Sandy..... to give thoughts to Sandy Jardine.... also any thoughts on Tims, I'd rather they qualified as coefficient will go up but more importantly they have ZERO chance in CL if you saw how Benfica could have pumped them 7-1 easily, whereas with Lennon adopting walter's 4-5-1 tactics they COULD actually do damage in the Europa League, any thoughts bears?...... hump Elgin and 5 pts plus game in hand league over by Xmas which all we wanted really wasn't it?....happy george WATP again

Will there be top flight football on show.?

21 Nov 2012 11:25:55
Judges of the 2012 Blog Prize, Suzanne Moore, Hopi Sen and Sean Dodson, said; ˜The 2012 Blog Prize showed that not only could blogs comment on current events, they could drive stories forward. Rangers Tax-Case takes what might be a dry topic “ the tax affairs of a sports team “ and shows how a striving for transitory success has severely distorted sporting, legal and ethical boundaries. Displaying focused contempt for those who evade difficult truths, and beating almost every Scottish football journalist to the real story “ Rangers Tax-Case shows how expertise and incisive writing can expose the hypocrisies the powerful use to protect themselves from the consequences of their actions. It is a worthy winner which not only proves that independent blogging is as healthy as it ever was, but also offers a mirror in which our times are reflected.'

'Bringing you the story that Scottish journalists seem unable to do.'

....AND GETTING THE RESULT WRONG!

Sue them all who lied slandered belittled rangers for there own gratification Scottish football is disgusting the way it lets itself be controlled by a bunch of cry babies who always claimed they were cheated never beatin. Well I think it's now quite clear we never cheated and even though they tried we will never be beatin

Just tweeted judges asking if in hindsight would they still have lavished such praise on a blog that acted as judge jury and executioner and was proved WRONG

as in the opening pages of the blog the author stated he had inside information and would prove rangers were guilty of tax evasion

maybe HMRC should employ such a first class inspector/detector because the ones they employ at the moment couldn't prove rangers done wrong costing the tax payer an estimated £5 Million

Lochaber Bear

But its agreed there is a bill to pay, so they are guilty of tax evasion in this case, may be in the £million range and not £10million range.

But on that point he was correct.

Yes they got decision wrong, so ?

Murray was so confident in his appeal he sold club for £1. ?

@3. There is a bill to pay in the respect of Craig Whyte who did not pay Tax or NI for the club. bigbaz

Sorry my mistake, Rangers would have been liable for the Tax/NI that CW did not pay, if we had not been liquidated. bigbaz

Should have said 'Oldco' Rangers. Having to rush out posts (not checking them) as i have a 'dicky tummy' - you get the picture? bigbaz

21 Nov 2012 11:25:02
Morning Percy's.......

I'm absolutely gobsmacked by the EBT decision. The fact the decision was split and not unanimous says it all, for me!

Don't rest on your laurels because HMRC should appeal and overturn this ludicrous decision!

Then, the investigation into dual contracts can be resumed and the removal of titles can be administered......it aint over yet wee teds!

PS: What about that coupon buster of a result last night? Didn't see a wee team like Benfica turning over the best club side in the world.....Europe will be taking notice of Benfica's excellent achievement, Celtic will march on though!

Miko x

Miko get over it. How many buckets of spew have you filled today.
Hayes

Miko even you dont believe that sh*t you've typed...mark.

Must be Giro day since youve re surrfaced Miko....think youll find St Johnstone are the best team in the world since they took more point off you last time than Barca did...as for your other wind up not worth commenting on...we won...x

Sucking at straws miko thats what your doing

campbell

What a bitter wee pill you are Miko

JG

21 Nov 2012 11:10:30
After watching last night's game all group winners must be hoping semtic get through, it was clear to see who were the better team, it would be a terrible for football if benfica never got through, anti football was taken to a new level by Celtic last nite.

Last night was not anti football just a too many bad performances on the one night,

21 Nov 2012 10:16:49
great piece by mr traynor today.
credit where it's due.
mtan

Is he the man with the "billionaire" wealth for whyte... if so read with caution, a man who does not allways check his facts... ?

daily record now releasing all details of who had ebts..... good time to bury bad news.

21 Nov 2012 09:06:06
I said it before all that was needed to win tax case was a technicality and there we are, and dispite the chances of hmrc being sued by oldco are nil perhaps all the oldco shareholders should get together and sue the b****cks of these pricks.

Blueice

Sue on what grounds. No matter the outcome of this case oldco were still guilty of not paying tax and paye and that's why they are no more not this case.

So why are hearts allowed to do a deal with hmrc Over unpaid tax yet we get slammed and shut down stinks like he'll double standards.one punishment should be applicable to all not just the rangers.

2)on the ridiculous amount that was quoted that rangers owed hmrc. The starting amount was £15 million, but instead of doing their homework and freezing that amount hmrc saw fit to continually adding fines for non payment, which in turn has put off potential investors and has directly led to the oldco going through liquidation, which has led to oldco shareholders loosing their investment. There for every shareholder should be able to sue for the minimum amount of shares in the newco which is £500 each. That and the cost of this case should add up to tens of millions and have every taxpayer in the country demanding answers as to why do hmrc workers apparently not have a clue what they are doing. Is that enough?

blueice

Double standards, hearts said yes we will pay it but give us more time, rangers said we wont pay ?

not same ?

@4 get it right, we offered a settlement years ago and HMRC rejected it

JG

@5...Years ago? That doesn't explain Rangers tax avoidance during the CW rein now does it!! Get your story right before ya clutch at those straws mate!
The facts are, your club withheld millions of pounds of tax, paye and NI contributions during this period! So your rangers still owes millions for this!
So get off your high horse and get the facts right!

@6 Learn to read posts properly before mouthing off and get your own facts right. JG's point was solely in relation to the EBT's and was a direct response to the 'we won't pay' comment of poster 4. Rangers made HMRC an offer in the region of £10m (some anorak will no doubt know the exact figure but think that was in the ball park) to settle out of court with HMRC 'years ago' as JG stated and they rejected it. Rangers did offer to pay (EBT's plus CW allegedly tried to broker a repayment deal with HMRC re PAYE and NI which was knocked back too) and by yesterday's ruling had previously offered far more than they were actually liable for in the end up in relation to the EBT's. JG, in connection to his point, was certainly not clutching at straws as you suggest.

However, to be fair to No4 who appears to me to have been referring more to PAYE and NI than EBT's their 'not same' comment does ring true in one regard. Hearts are not in administration (yet) and do not have a '90-150m' tax bill from the very same HMRC they are dealing with hanging over their heads. Clearly they had a reasonable chance of an offer being accepted and happily for their fans it was. Because of the massive figure involved in the now flawed BTC HMRC effectively put us into liquidation instead and they will get peanuts for wrongly doing so as a consequence. There is a massive difference between the two situations. Remove the BTC and HMRC would probably have agreed a repayment deal regarding the non-payment of PAYE and NI that led to our administration in the first place (obviously instigated by CW) as we have a far greater income than Hearts with a similar income expenditure % level of overall debt at the time (before it spiralled obviously). The substantial figure which is now still owed is because HMRC refused to do a deal as they were including the BTC (in hindsight an unwise approach), didn't treat them as separate cases and continuously lumped on interest at a ridiculous rate. If you think about it HMRC have made a complete and utter hash of this entire process from start to finish and have spent multi millions of the tax payers pounds (i.e. yours AND mine) with very little hope of even reclaiming half (and that is a generous assessment) of what they have spent on it. Those are the facts as I see it, clearly you disagree. That still doesn't mean I think you are on your high horse as you accused JG of being.

Brian {The Ed039's Note - SDM offered HMRC £11m to settle out of court a few years ago)

21 Nov 2012 08:48:26
I am delighted that we have won the BTC. Does anyone feel, now this cloud has lifted we will get more investors in? Also, the biggest winners of this whole situation are celtic, who have 4 years at the Champions League without competition due to a threat of what we 'owed'

Makes you wonder whether some people had some influence here.
We did not need to be proven guilty, just so long as the case ran long enough for us to go to the wall. We had other debts but nothing that player sales would not have paid off. Instead those player walked for free (or virtually nothing) as the oldco was put out of business. Moreover, the club has had additional penalties for entry to the third division. The whole thing stinks !

21 Nov 2012 07:47:32
congrats to all at rangers football club and our supporters on winning the big tax case. its a great feeling this morning waking up knowing i still support the most succesful club side in the world, and now we can put to bed all the rubbish that was written about us being guilty of cheating our way to titles. sorry "obssesed" , you wont be getting your grubby little hands on any of our titles now. you cant beat us on the pitch and now in court it proves you cant beat us off it . !!

What really annoys me is they drove this made there feelings clear hounded there own club and other clubs to not vote us back in. Now every team in the SPL is suffering bar Celtic. Honestly is this how envious of us they are that they would rather see the whole of Scottish football suffer for there own gain. They tried to kill us of this is the outcome they wanted and with any other club they would have got there wish. But not with us we refused to lie down when they hit us with all there bile that we were cheats that we bought titles that our history was gone. Well sorry it certainly has not and now we are baying for blood the SPL and the SFA are going to have there nuts tickled. Murray is already taking legal advice and green and rangers should be to we have been blackmailed and cheated by the SPL monies we were entitled to have been withheld illegally and we have been hit with enough guff to last a lifetime. You tried to kill us of. And failed let's see how the rest of you survive when we come looking for revenge. Ps where have all the east end tax experts and sporting integrity lawyers gone there silence is defining

21 Nov 2012 00:52:46
Delighted with tax case ruling. However I feel pig sick. This BTC is the root cause of our woes. Had this not been an issue the club would have attracted buyers, and we would never have heard of Craig Whyte.

We wouldb be in SPL probably playing in CL. Now we are in div three, years away from Europe.

The length of time taken over this is ridiculous and whilst they are sitting about the consequences took their course.

I have this horrible feeling that all this could have been avoided and find it incredible that this case which we have won is the reason we are where we are.

I would hope to read a few apologies from the press and more importantly the BBC and those clubs and fans alike that declared us cheats. those that accused us and beat us to death with claims of lack of "sporting integrity" should show they don't lack integrity by making a full apology.

My head is down, I am disgusted with HMRC, but I can at least hold my head high again. We are Rangers, we have always been Rangers and will be Rangers forever.

Rangers win.... well almost - they dont have to pay full £25 million tax bill.

Just 35 out of 80+ ebt are liable for tax, so maybe they owe £12 million + penalties for late payments.

So rangers directors could have offered 50% in first case, rather than fight. But choose to fight, and have won just 55 ebts out of 80+?

looks like score draw to me...

rangers owe less, HRMC win £12+ million

and to boot rangers in liquidation...? where is this a win for rangers ?

One man came out of this with his integrity intact. That is SFL chairman David Longmuir. When asked by the SPL to remove League Cups from Rangers he stated that at this point in time RFC had not been found guilty of anything. The SFA and SPL chairmen had predertmind the HMRC result and started spewing Sporting Integrity. The sound of silence from them is deafining. Iwonder if any of of them will now appologise.

Right first off 2 things,well done on the BTC doesn't matter what happens from today onwards it's put to bed rangers won it.secondly I'll hold my hand up I was on here for months giving it up to your knees in ebt etc so hey we got it wrong.

End of the day Murray tried to buy success and failed.the bbc might have got the ebt stuff wrong but either way it showed how Murray worked and when Lloyd took over BOS they saw the state of rangers were in.i don't know how much money Murray pumped into your lot but he put the for sale sign up for nearly 4 years and no one would touch them due to the ebt and 18m debt.that was the very first thing on Lloyds agenda getting that paid.

No business man would pay 18m (over X years) and then might get hit with a tax bill too.unless its someone like whyte who saw assets sitting there.

If the ebt thing was put to bed years ago then I still don't believe rangers would be any better off than they are just now end of the day 18m had to be paid back sooner rather than later,murray sold a club he got success but got a lot of debt in doing it

Once again well done on the ebt but I believe Murray will still go into hiding until the oldco is finished...completely

Lenny

@1

It is a win in that it proves the ebt system used by Rangers/ Murray group were used in a legal manner. Rangers were branded cheats- mostly from the east end financial wizards- they were guilty without trial in their eyes. Apologies will now be flooding onto this page, surely sporting integrity etc.

Where did you read 35 I heard there were only 6 and rangers won't face tax payments of more than 4mil

The stripping of titles is for dual contracts and had very little to do with wheather EBT's were legal or not.
Don't want your titles anyway, hope you keep them.

Joeshmo1888

Ally not getting into CL is the root cause now.

@6. yeah right for not wanting them you dont half go on about them. also the spl will now find it hard to pass a guilty verdict against rangers. people on here seem to think the FTT and the dual contract investigation are totally different things but why would rangers have to include loans in a players contract? also dont forget all payments where in the accounts handed over to the spl every year...mark.

@8. Please show me another post where i have asked for titles back?

Joeshmo1888

@9. you have posted in the past that rangers should be stripped of titles won by in your words CHEATING! and you have also posted that all trophies won by rangers in that period should be handed to the rightful winners im sure the ed can clear this up if he can be bothered and if ive confused you with another of our celtic visitors then im big enough to apologise to you...mark.

Youd better start saying sorry mark.

Joeshmo1888

20 Nov 2012 23:36:23
Just watched an MP on Scottish Newsnight saying it's disgraceful that wealthy people are trying to avoid paying their fare share in a time of such austerity and that regulations should be changed to stop it from happening and the whole procedure should be made more transparent so people can actually see whats happening.
Was he talking about Rangers or was he talking about MP's expenses?. Flipping homes, leasing your own properties then claiming expenses to rent your friends, claiming for expensive items and work carried out, claiming expenses for members of your family to be employed by you, refusing to name your landlord in an attempt to hide the truth and taking month long holidays to appear on a reality show seems to be doing to the public the very thing that he has just accused Rangers of (except Rangers have just won their case, would he be so confident of the MP's winning theirs).
"People in glass houses"..

HMRC have won various cases of mismanaged EBTs. Banks and various high profile tv celebs. Rangers on the other hand won there case. It then proves that they DID work within the law and have been vindicated in the judgement. So channel 4 news guy and the failed teacher wiyh the weird Irish name , please come back put from under your brick and appologise.