Rangers Rumours Archive April 27 2012

 

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27 Apr 2012 21:01:10
BBCDouglsFraser:
Rangers administrators state Bill Miller needs clarity on SFA/SPL penalties, would capitalise RFC. Murray/Kennedy insist they need Craig Whyte's shares as part of bid conditions, has this moved forward any? Seems to me like same old same old?

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I think mr whyte should do the right thing and hand the shares back to the rangers fans

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He will when you pay him his 30 million.

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Thats right he is the owner so he is due his 30m by the way for every 10p yous put down well put down a tenner,.,kbarry

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Wake up, this is all pre match positivity as per usual.Monday's headlines will be, bids rejected.

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You mean the £30m that started with Ticketus? A swiz if ever there was one.

Bill M is right to seek clarity and TBK are right to require the shares (presumably Bill M needs these too otherwise what is he is actually buying - rights to the Rangers name?)

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Aye right it's Craig White he has ran rings around the Government's finest lawyers, The tax and VAT men, Business men all over the world, Rangers won't be his last victim and the only way they will get his shares is to pay him whatever he demands, that's why Murry hired him yes HIRED.

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27 Apr 2012 21:20:43
I see the BBC have been shown documents that suggest when the finances are examined, the BK and TBK bid is significantly LESS than BM's offer in real terms. It seems both deals seeks £7 Million bond holders credit being moved out of a CVA. However Kights bid presumptively INCLUDES this in their capital offer figures. A classic case of using money that's not your own yet. Does that remind us of anyone??? Jeez there is a brewery advertising for three organisers!!

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What are you on about?

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A classic case of BBC negative spin on ANY story involving Rangers. Thanks for that.

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Just like when they said craig whyte was a bit dodgy. they got that wrong eh?

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Neither bid will be acceptable and ticketus are positioning to block any CVA

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FFS. How simple does this have to be put. It looks like 7 mill of the dough the Knights and the Hibee glory hunter are stumping up, isnae theirs yet. But the bid Tow Truck Bill is offering is all his own wedge. Once he gets the club, he will access that 7 mill then (if he can get it).

Its like me goin intae the bookies askin to put on a £500 line and sayin "Ah'm no payin the noo, just take it oot ma winnings!"

We are attracting every bumper nut wi a bit of wegde but nae intentions of buying. Glory hunters the lot. Ah'm no annoyed at the SFA it all these bawheids that harp on about 'best interests' and 'protecting the history'. Ah think we are pumped until ah see keys getting handed over and a bum in the Big Office.

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As I have been saying for weeks, No deal will go ahead until someone pays off Craig Whyte. He still legally owns the club and is entitled to sell the club for how much he see'e fit. Also if anyone thinks Ticketus will simply let the money they are due just dissolve is out of their tiny mind. Selling the assets of Rangers FC will bring them far more than what a CVA will ever do.

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Hear hear! When can we start? If someone can arrange an announcement for a deadline to schedule a final deadline re the announcement. Oh wait we've missed the deadline!

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Ticketus can get their money back from a CVA, CW is a secured creditor under any circumstances, he pays off Ticketus and HMRC get the bulk of the rest, maybe 10p in the pound,about 7-8 million, not to be sniffed at, no point in crying about the lost 72 million its gone, and giving away 8 million aint gonna change that.


HMRC will take the money, or explain to the tax payer why nothing is better than 8 million. There is one policy that overrides all policies, the best interests of the taxpayer is paramount.

Anorak.

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When is 0 better than 8 mill (assuming 10p in the £ ) ?
When your next targets are the big boys in the EPL and you want to send a clear message!
Pay up or go the way of RFC.
Portsmouth got a CVA only because HMRC didn't have the necessary 25% creditor status. They did vote against one by the way.

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HMRC will not take the money,and will quite happily explain to the british public why not.If they allowed this scam to succeed,everyone would just stop paying then offer a few pence in the pound.More businesses would go into administration or liquidate,just to avoid tax,the lawyers would make even more money,people would beccome unemployed because their company took the easy way out.HMRC would see this as an easy sell to the decent,tax paying citizens of the UK.
Both bids are doomed to failure(and the bidders knew that before they submitted them),and are just people jockeying for position for when the club/assets cum up for sale.Hopefully we may at this stage,see a couple of genuine bidders with serious financial backing joining the fray.a newco is the only way forward and if we want to play in any league next season,then the quicker we liquidate and start again the better.pre season training would be due to start in around 7-8 weeks.We shouls also forget about what quality of squad we have for next season.the priority is just to have some sort of team(and a place to play,it may not be ibrox)that can fulfill our fixtures and let us build for the future.
If you think we're going to sail on in the SPL as if nothing's happened,with no penalties etc,you've another thing coming.

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Anorak, HMRC won't decide, oh well £8m is better than nothing, because of a term called 'moral hazard' (google it). If Rangers are dissolved and go out of existence, and they are £8m worse off than they would have been under a CVA, you can bet a lot of the other football clubs in England which owe them £bns will stump up rather than go out of existence (we are a nice high profile test case for HMRC, don't think we're the only ones). If they give us a CVA, everyone else will say, why should we pay in full, we'll just do a CVA too. The big picture is HMRC don't do CVAs and people making out we're coming out of this in a CVA are delusional and don't have the intelligence to understand how HMRC operates. The club is going to be liquidated, FACT. All that is to be decided is what the new club looks like and which league we play in, and who owns it, and what penalties the SFA make us play under.

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Taxman won't except a cva and Mr Whyte still wants paid for his shares

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Why HMRC won't accept a CVA, a simple example.

Suppose I'm a loan shark, and I lend every guy in my local pub £1000.

A week later, the first guy comes back and says I can't pay it back, all I've got is £50.

CVA Option: I say £50 is better than nothing mate, give me £50.

Liquidate Option: I say, I'm sending the boys round to break your legs and rob your house for whatever I can get to pay me back.

Now look at all the other guys that owe me money in the pub. What chance any of them want to pay me back the full amount if I take the CVA option?

If I take the Liquidate option, you can bet most of them will pay me back.

Therefore I'm better off with the Liquidate Option, not cause it gets me more money out of this one guy, but because of the effect it has on the other guys.

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cva will be achieved. it is it the taxmans interest to assist business with cvas. long term tax return is better. To coin one of ur examples... if every business got liquidated there would be no jobs...

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Administration and being sold under a CVA is a moral hazard to any new owner, when the owner loses everything. Therefore there is no difference between the effects of this CVA and liquidation, except HMRC lose 7-8 million.
Future EBT outcomes involving other companies are not affected by any decision to agree to a Rangers CVA, they will each be assessed on an individual basis. The main concern to HMRC is owners being rewarded for tax evasion, neither SDM or CW will make a dime out of a CVA.

Rangers are insolvent, this is a hazard to any owner and hardly an incentive to evade tax.
HMRC do deals on tax issues all the time, Rangers are not some unique case except in the minds of some celtic fans who think biased blogs are gospel.

Let me repeat, if HMRC's policy was set in stone, then Rangers would have been liquidated months ago.

Please don't come on her quoting extracts from the rangerstaxcase or scotslaw blogs as if they represent the views of HMRC, THEY DO NOT.

The vast majority of EBT cases will not even involve administration or liquidation, companies will negotate payment terms and HMRC will acept them to avoid making the company insolvent. Think about the reasons why...it involves money, HMRC make financial considerations as a standard policy.

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Bond holders rank higher than share holders when it comes to claims on the assets, so removing bondholders debts means more for the buyer. I hope the bondholders stand firm on this.

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I think you are missing the point about HMRC and a tough stance. They may be very willing to put one club out of busniess to ensure the others pay up!

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HMRC will not accept a CVA . "10p in the pound is better than nothing " HMRC are looking at at least 8 clubs in England so you think they are going to create a precedent of accepting a pitance ? what message does that send ? I am afrair HMRC will be using RFC ( IA )as a warning to other tax cheating clubs. I believe HMRC are willing to close down RFC ( IA ) as an example. It has been 11 weeks since admin began and a resolution is not any nearer

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27 Apr 2012 20:16:13
Official bid from bill miller received by rangers
Ssn

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Two bids big deal....stubbling block....Monday - more sanctions, Craig Whyte shares, Ticketus, BTK, C.V.A...
Good Luck on those.

I heard Miller thinks Ibrox is worth a fortune, apparently SHERGAR is buried under neath the Celtic End 6 yard box......

Biffo the Bear

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27 Apr 2012 20:21:57
administrators said >>> "In terms of quantum, there are significant differences between the two offers in terms of a prospective return to creditors and approach to future funding and these have to be evaluated. hmmm i wonder which bidder will be the best for rangers ????????..... answers on a postcard please.....jsm

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Miller's bid was approx 11 million for the assets, I think the bid by BK-TBKs is around 35 million. 27 million to CW for Ticketus and 8 million for the ordinary creditors.

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So i hope the bk gets us then...jsm

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It is not about what is best for rangers. The administrators role is to get what is best for the creditors

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According to BBC Millers bid is better

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Oh i know the admin are there to get best deal for preditors, no doubt about it, but that being said paying the preditors a fair $$ and having the right people in charge of the best team in scotland will be the best for rangers...jsm

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Yes Millers bid would be better for creditors, but I dont think he would be bothered about putting Gers into liquidation to get what he wants out of the deal, whereas the blue knights would not want that, titles are the last thing on alot of fans minds just now, I just want our club to survive guys, and the blue knights seem to be the way to go, as long as there is transparency in how they are getting the club on a level footing, we dont want anymore surprises like footballs equivalent of a payday loan sneeking in to the papers in the future

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Surely ticketus wont get there 27million in one go? Since it was agreed over another three seasons?

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Oh i know the admin are there to get best deal for preditors, no doubt about it, but that being said paying the preditors a fair $$ and having the right people in charge of the best team in scotland will be the best for rangers...jsm

Paying the preditors, what a statement, you are deluded to think that money owed to people by Rangers are preditors. They gave Rangers the money or credit in good faith and you manage to turn it into a negative, its no wonder the other side call us Scotlands Shame. Disgraceful comment. There are some decent Rangers fans out here who would like to make sure that the companies that are due money get it.

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The crux of the matter is this. None of these bidders has enough funds to make a cva more appealing to the creditors than liqidation. Sums of around £10million are being suggested when Rangers' liabilities are around £50-60million notwithstanding the BTC. Liquidation seems inevitable. Liah Smit

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Preditors? Would that be the wee guy with the paper shop who does a 12 hour day 6 days a week and has built his family business over generations , or the 5 or 6 who are deffo going bankrupt if they don't get paid. The ones with mouths to feed.? NO WONDER THE RANGERS LOOSE NEUTRAL SUPPORT DAILY with attitudes like this.

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Pred·a·tor/ˈpredətər/
Noun:
An animal that naturally preys on others.
A rapacious, exploitative person or group.
does this not sum up cw and bm and other teams sniffing around our players...jsm

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The 27 million is for 3 seasons worth of tickets. £40 million goes to ticketus if the deal goes on as its meant to.

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Well what's best for Rangers is secondary in this process as D&P work for the creditors, effectively. Obviously the Rangers brand has an ongoing value which is higher in terms of CVA than liquidation, and that will be recognised. But is it high enough to make the CVA generous enough for creditors?

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27 Apr 2012 19:57:32
steve lomas already quoted as saying the rangers situation is affecting his preperation for next season.

imagine if the sky deal goes. the revenue from gers fans.

what if we got liquidated? The house of cards that is the SPL would begin to tumble.

ryanrfc

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Nah, it would improve. 12 Scottish teams

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The SPL is bad enough just now.

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Dunfermline struggled without 80,000

st. johnstone claim the situation is affecting thier preperation

just wait until, sky pull the plug - thats around £1m-£1.5m a season alone to a club if not more.

ticket money provided by gers fans would amount to around 100,000

this would effect every team in the spl bar celtic who have a large enough fan base to continue as stong as they think they are at the moment.

but you st. johnstone's, hearts, dundee utd's ect would all go the wall.


you need us to survive
regardless or what you think

ryanrfc

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SPL want us to stay in the SPL because of the money Rangers generate, but at the same time, dont want us competing for honours with these sanctions. WELL THEY CANT HAVE IT BOTH WAYS!!

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The trouble is the Celtic so called fans really don't think rangers demise will not effect Scottish football

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I would have no remorse if st johnstone suffer,they got a kick at us aswell

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If the fans of spl teams other than rangers and celtic supported their teams the way they do when cup semis and finals come along they wouldn,t have to worry if rangers aren,t there and they call the old firm glory hunters.

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"nah , it would improve 12 Scottish teams"
Really ?????

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Spoke to a "rebel 10" chairman recently - i will call them the majority ten... His quote was simple "Before rangers started cheating their way to winning games with players they couldn't afford.. every goal..every save, every tackle.. in a time gone by there were fans at games, because they had something to play for.. all that SKY money brings is £1m to every club. It equates to 2800 more fans at home games per season....which when assessing average attendances in 80s and 90s EVERY team can achieve this - especially with 3pm kick offs and NO tv games.
Yes every team will not have 5000 Rangers fans at games but that equates to around £100,000 a year in revenue... ( 1 game at £20 a head x 5000) - If every away team brought another 300 fans with them - it will cover it... 300 x £20 x 17.. Scottish football will survive... I actually hope Rangers survive too - but if they are allowed to stay in the SPL - Scottish football can just give up. And yes - I AM a rangers fan and season ticket holder.

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There is no point denying other clubs would suffer if rangers went bust. However that is irrelevant rangers have to be punished for cheating for decades. Every team in scotland will suffer more if there is no sporting integrity, they may as well just give the trophies to the self proclaimed special club. As Kevin Costner says when playing Elliot Ness in the untouchables "let justice be done even if the heavens fall"

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Why punish all spl clubs ...just because u guy are struggling dont take it out on others

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Without Rangers the league will be more open and the race for Europe open to more clubs, which will entice more people to go to the games.

Also, since all of the dummy spitters are claiming they will be boycotting away fixtures, then it would make no difference if Rangers are not in the league next season. In some respect, with a fairer distribution of cash to all clubs, the money lost from gate receipts will not effect everyone too badly.

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Its the rangers way, lash out at everyone else for their own faults, we have seen it time and time again. Boycott this, march to that, intimidate this, they are a dishevelled fan base who are unable to organise anything that will make a difference. Their fan group, trusts , assembly and co have only ever been able to unite when it was anti celtic, but they seem innept at this time.

Murray gave you a decade of success and that has killed your club because you did not pay for it, but murray gets of scot free because this fanbase is incapable of looking further back than last week.

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You can use the ridiculous Jim Traynor argument using dunfermline as an example if you want but the problem there was they were owed money by Rangers and were accounting for it being paid, not that they couldnt budget themselves as a club.

I budget my own finances and like to think I do a decent job of it but if my wages didnt clear I'd be in trouble. That is the same as Dunfermline's situation was.

If there was no Rangers in the SPL clubs would adjust their budgets to suit.

I think if that was the case then next season would be a write off as every club would be very cautious with their finances.
When it became apparent though that the league was a lot more open and there was more to play for fans would start coming back to games. More fans brings more money, more money to the smaller clubs means a more competetive league.

The SKY deal is important but fans attending games is the main objective. As someone pointed out it doesnt take many extra fans to make up for the sky money.

Mac

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"Scottish football can survive without the Old Firm. It'll mean other clubs have a chance to be successful.' - Walter Smith, 1999.
Remember this? What selective memorys you have. You dont give a toss for anyone but urselves

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I am a Celtic fan and I am convinced the whole of Scottish football will suffer to a degree from RFC ( IA ) demise. But we all would just have to live with that. Scottish football will , after a period of time, find its own level.If that that is the same as the League of Ireland so be it.
We will all be punished along with RFC ( IA ) but it wiil have to be done FOR THE SAKE OF THE INTEGRITY OF THE GAME IN THIS COUNTRY. The SFA and SPL better take heed of the recent poll saying c.97 % of fans do not want a newco put straight back into the SPL. Now that would destroy Scottish football. The rangers fans agrre they should be punished BUT THEY DON'T WANT THE PUNISHMENT !

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27 Apr 2012 12:22:59
If ED022 is around, I heard you do
player profiles...
What is your opinion of Llorente of
Athletic Bilbao?
Do you think he will come to Britain
and what sort of fee would he command
and I would imagine huge wages also
Cheers Timalloy {Ed022's Note - I am indeed here mate. I've profiled Llorente so if you want to check it out over on www.player-profiles.co.uk then you're more than welcome to. But to answer your question I'll just copy over my comments regarding Llorente. They are as follows: Llorente is a very good player, of that there is no doubt. His best attribute by far is his heading ability, as it really is brilliant on how he is able to direct his headers so accurately with so much power. What's more, he does it week in and week out. He's a set piece's dream, as he just seems to score from them. However, he can also strike a ball very well. Once again,his accuracy of the ball is wonderful, as he seems to find corners of the goal tremendously leaving the keeper no chance at all. What worries me though is his ability (or lack of) to settle down in clubs. In his local club of Bilbao it took him 3 seasons to get up and running and you have to ask yourself, if he came to the Premier League, would he be given 2-3 seasons to settle down? No, he wouldn't. He is a very good player as I've said, but in my honest opinion, he wouldn't fit into the English game, as it is probably too physical of a league for him, and probably a league where players come under way too much scrutiny, because after all, it is the best league in the world. I may be wrong though, and he could potentially move to England and set it alight, much like Aguero did. However, I personally think that Llorente's style is suited to the spanish league, and not necessarily that of the English. However, he is a superb player and one I really enjoy watching. - I would also say that the fee that will be demanded will be roughly 30million as well mate, but it depends on bidders etc, and could raise to a lot more. My specialty certainly is on European players etc, and not necessarily the ins and outs of Rangers, so if you need an evaluation of a player etc, then I'm your guy haha! I'd say Llorente's form as of late has been superb though, and he's beginning to persuade me he could just cut it in the Prem. But his wages would be a severe amount, and the likelihood of him moving anytime soon is unlikely to be honest.}

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Yeah this is a RANGERS page ! So jog on! Seriously who gives a sh!t !
PaulRFC

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Me thinks timlloy is on the wrong page,, {Ed022's Note - There's no harm in asking a question about a football player.}

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I think he's got enough to hack it in the prem, as he's clearly quite strong, fast enough and skillful. I agree totally that his style is more suited to Spain, though. I also think that the atmosphere at Bilbao is a very close knit community one, and i doubt he'd want to leave and - considering they only play players from the Basque region - I'm not sure his club would let him go as he is almost irreplaceable. Muzz {Ed022's Note - Good post mate.}

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Yeah but im sure he couldve asked in his own page
will1872 {Ed022's Note - What own page?}

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ED022 thanks for that, I also was told from our ED007 that being Basque he would not want to leave Bilbao, hope they now win Europa Cup Timalloy
PS ha ha Paul RFC and others you left yourselves open pals, "Football" site then WHY are you all on here? LOL Timalloy {Ed001's Note - he is top class, Bilbao rejected a £35m offer from Liverpool, the money that ended up being spent on Carroll.}

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ED001 as a Red, I bet you wished Lllorente had signed instead of Carrol...
Timalloy {Ed001's Note - without a doubt, he was my first choice striker that I kept putting forward in the run up to that January. But we never sign the players I want, the only one I can remember we got was Alonso. Llorente and Martinez would be my dream signings, along with Honda.}

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Llorente to Chelsea just wait and see!

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Do you think we cold get him on a free from Bilbao then we could sell him instantly for said £35mill to help the club?

(I'm kidding, obviously). What's you thought's on Muinian (sp), that boy seems a fair talent too! {Ed001's Note - yes, but he has had a few off field issues, they were offering him to some clubs in January for 40m Euros. Good player though, a real special talent for the future.}

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Maybe he asked on here because Ed022 doesn't edit the Celtic page. Think about it before giving out lame replies.

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27 Apr 2012 18:43:21
Would it not be possible to have those who benefitted from EBT's to pay back to Rangers their gains ? {unless of course they had a letter saying that they didn't have to but even then , that may stand up to the scrutiny of the courts .)

Paddy Malarkey

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The players didnt benefit from the EBT's.
the club was the beneficery of this system.
look at it this way:
a player on £1m per year,
£500,000 paid through wages and taxed, rangers pay £250,000
£500,000 paid through EBT, rangers pay zero in tax.
to scale this up for every £4m in wages paid via EBT rangers saved £1m in tax.
This was always about avoiding tax, being able to pay players more than the club could afford, the players were not the ones that benefited

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Your havin a malarkey. graeme

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A usty go tae the paddy malarkys fur ma maw, lol

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Dream on

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To the first reply to the original. So from your take on it Rangers paid players wages through EBTs if thats the case they are screwed as EBTs are not for wages.

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When the club transfer money to the EBT Trustees,it's no longer theirs.If anyone actually repaid their "loan",it would be to the trustees,not the club.Once it's gone,it's gone.

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Virtually all players that were paid in this way wouldn't have known about it. It's not their fault.

GovanFR

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To last post, rubbish of course they knew. Their payslip showed lower basic salary and they were taxed accordingly, for example they could have been paid minimum wage and then paid balance do salary as a "loan". of course the players benefited, it was designed primarily for that purpose.

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...not forgetting the EBT "loans" weren't made by rangers, but by the EBT trusts. The money was 'Paid' by RFC to the trust ... at which point RFC lost any title to it, and then 'loaned' to the player by the the trust. Therefore even if the loans were to be repaid the money, repayments would go to the trust, and not to Rangers. There is no mechanism by which any money would be repaid to RFC, since the beneficiaries of the trust are the employees, not the club.

And you are right to say that they are screwed because EBTs are not for wages. This is the overwhelming consensus I am afraid, although we won't know for sure until the FTT actually returns a verdict.

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27 Apr 2012 18:33:35
D&P to release statement this evening. PM tells BBC that their offer is higher than American bid.

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27 Apr 2012 18:18:08
why all the negativity around this bid lets wait n see if it gets accepted,people in here think they know it all,paul murray is not going into this with his eyes shut,he knows more than us all,to make out this consortium bid is not good is ludicrous we have 5 millionaires and a guy that has more cash than septic chairman 3 times over,there not daft in paul murray i trust

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Who are the 5 millionaires and the billionaire who is worth more that Dermot Desmond ?
The bids on the table cannot be accepted by D&P as they are conditional offers

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So what if one of the Blue Knights has 3 times the money of Ian Bankier? Dermot Desmond isn't short of a few quid either.

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You are spot on, there is far too much negativity coming in to this site - even potentially good news is scorned. We know we have been completely in the wrong, but we still want to see Rangers survive!

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Add the wealth of the blue nights together and you don't even come up with the wealth of celtics majority shareholder.

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I assume you refer to Brian Kennedy reports stipulate he is worth £250 million - Dermont Desmond is worth 1.35billion even with an exchange rate that dwarfs £250m & am a Blue nose lol

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And that's why initially they could not afford the 500 grand security fee?

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Well said. I think there are far too many Philadelphia lawyers posting here. Didn't realise there were so many legal experts. The CVA is subject to agreement of 75% in value of those creditors entitled to and who vote either in person or by proxy at the meeting. So Ticketus and HMRC seem to be the major creditors (in value) - just what precisely is Whyte's 'value' in this context? As the poster has said, let's wait and see what the bids are (from Bill Miller too) and then see what happens. Ticketus perhaps shouldn't have been so stupid/greedy to jump at Whyte's suggestion!

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The wealth of the celtic chairman is so irrevelent! Celtic are a PLC, not a rich man play thing.
Both bids CAN NOT be accepted as the conditions on both are not delieverable.

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Who is this billionaire, why doesn't he buy Rangers outright and not put in conditions that D+p can't deliver fed up of this in out in out again and putting in bid that are unacceptable frustrated bear

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Billionaire? What like Whyte was why didn't he come in last year rather than letting Murray sell us down the river for a pound sick of all these guys talking no action

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Billionaire? What like Whyte was why didn't he come in last year rather than letting Murray sell us down the river for a pound sick of all these guys talking no action

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Whos got mer money than dermott,dream on

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Kennedy has a personal fortune of 250 million. Desmond is a billionaire (a real one). Must try harder.

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Bad news for the blue knights as it appears now bill miller has submitted his final bid for rangers and according to a reliable source close to duff and phelps his bid will be accepted and the liquidation proccess of rangers football club will begin after sunday's old firm game at parkhead. this has been on the cards for a long time and now it is really happening its a shocking situation and now a club with such a great history is dead and no newco will ever replace rangers fc. i am totally disgusted at sir david murray and craig whyte they both should be brought to justice for what they have done yeah we enjoyed the good times but we did not ask them to break any rules especially sir david murray he went after glory in europe and failed. sorry guys liquidation definitely happening. {Ed022's Note - How many final bids have there been now?}

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So please tell me who is worth more than Dermot Desmond?
I think you should get your facts right as obviously you have not got a clue......... Unless you know that his wealth is off the radar..

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So rich they could'nt come up with 500k? I think not.....don't get all deluded again. The bid is conditional on some very big "ifs". Rankers are going down the toilet....back where they belong. Go to the 3 division and come back with some humility and dignity.

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In reply to ed022 note this will be the final bid i have it on very good authority that the blue knights bid has failed and the finalisation proccess has started with bill millers bid an announcement will not be made until after the celtic game also this is bad news not just for rangers but for the sfa the spl and scottish football in general and more bad news will be delivered when sky pull out of scottish football as there contract allows them to pull out if anything happened to rangers or celtic this is critical and i am afraid scottish football is no more we will be down there with the likes of the estonian and irish leagues a joke.

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The bids on the table cannot be accepted by D&P as they are conditional offers-------========

I am sorry my friend but this is utter tripe, the two conditions are unavoidable conditions of any bid under a CVA.

One, the CVA must be agreed by the creditors and two, the owner must agree to sell his shares.

Without ether conditions there is no sale for goodness sake, how can D&Ps possibly reject any bid because of these two essential conditions. How can you reject a CVA bid for the shares on grounds the bid is conditional on a CVA and the shares ?

If you are just going to make stuff up then try and make it plausible.


Anorak.

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TBKs did not hand over the 500k because they did not have it, they did not hand it over because they hadn't done a deal with Ticketus.

I smell fear in the celic ranks, all their dreams of Rangers being liquidated going down the pan.

Anorak.

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Anorak your a joke yourself there is no way rangers will survive i am telling you this is the beginning of the end rangers are dead and buried and the sooner you accept this the sooner you can move on. and if any newco comes i wouldnt get your hopes up on them being world beaters they will be a mid table team who never have anything to play for except relegation battles.

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" big ifs "....lmao.

The bid is conditional on the two most basic requirements of a CVA bid for the shares..... a CVA and the shares.

What are you talking about ?

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The blue knights have the spirit and there heart is in the right place but they do not have the capital to get rangers out of trouble and i firmly believe when the big tax case result is announced it will be at least 50 million pounds so there is no way rangers can survive that along with the other debts i have to say sundays old firm will be the last and i for one hope rangers win it and it is not remembered for all the wrong reasons. the final nail in the coffin of rangers will be delivered by duff and phelps when they hand the keys to bill miller ibrox and murray park will be sold rangers players will be let go along with the other staff and rangers will be no more.

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There is more comments from septic fans than rangers fans,brian kennedys worth alone has been quoted from 300 million to 3 billion who knows,as for the rest of the consortium who honestly knows there worth except them,it doesnt matter anyway all that matters is rangers are restored as a football club

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You do not need to be worth any more than 40 million to buy Rangers.

I believe Rangers will be competitive next year without their high earners and with no new players. I have watched Celtic, they are no great shakes and have obvious problems when placed under pressure.

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Which part of CVA do celtic fans not understand, it doesn't matter if 50 millon is the BTC debt, it all goes in the pot.

Its fairly simple, the consortium offers 35 million to the CVA, CW gets 27 million as a secured creditor to give to Ticketus and hands over his shares. HMRC get offered 10p in the pound ( 7 million) or nothing in liquidation.

They will do a deal.

Ally lifts Champion League trophy in 2013-14 and is knighted by the Queen.

Ok, I am going too far, its Friday.

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Excuse me for asking is Paul Murray the Paul Murray who was a Board member while David Murray controlled the company? Is Paul Murray a Chartered Accountant? Why was he appointed to the Board? What were his responsibilities and function? How much was his remuneration and benefits? Did he receive any money or benefits from the Employee Benefit Trust? Did he receive any other benefits or remuneration from any other tax efficient structure? If his bid is successful what position will he take? Will this be full time? What will his personal investment total? How much of this is borrowed? Given Murray's association with a previous and discredited regime and would hope these legitimate questions can be passed on and answered.

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The same paul murray - his role as non -excecutive director was to be the goalkeeper and watch how the club was being run etc. he failed miserabley and the result will be liquidation

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27 Apr 2012 18:06:36
Craig Whyte is not going to give up his shares until he gets a guarantee that he will not be chased for any money/debts.

If he gets an assurance from The Blue Knights & ticketus that he will not be pursued then I think he may be willing to give up his shares. This would then leave TBK & ticketus to try an negotiate a deal.

No-one knows what has been said behind the scenes, have Ticketus been told that TBK will hold a share issue and money from that will be given to them and the rest will be negotiated over a certain period of time? Who knows.

We are at a stage where someone needs to be given the chance to try and save the club, so lets get the preffered bidder in and lets see if they/we can save the club.

There is still a long way to go, but lets not give up.

The Pilot!

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Surley it wuld be Her Majesty's Constabulary who would decide if Mr Whyte would or would not be pursued for possible wrongdoing ? Or are the Blue Knights now assuming regulatory functions ?

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I agree with your conclusion, something is going on behind the scenes with Bk coming in and Ticketus standing back.
I think between them they have guaranteed Ticketus their money as long as they guarantee CWs shares.

I just don't swallow the excuse Ticketus gave about the SFA sanctions, for a start they may be overturned in an appeal and they only last one year. Ticketus is a 4 year deal for only a percentage of ticket sales.

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For the judiciary to decide who owes what. Muzz

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For all Craig Whyte is I'm pretty sure that he is shrewd enough to do everything within the letter of the law. My point is that he is not going to just hand over his shares until he knows that he is in the clear. If he is to be chased for money then I'm positive whatever he owes will soon become what he believes his shares are worth.

In this long process Cw will want to be the final piece in the jigsaw so that he gets away scot free or with a profit in his pocket.

The Pilot!

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27 Apr 2012 17:24:03
Guys,...i'm not quite getting this, anybody help me here.

Ticketus knocked back a 10m deal with the blue knights,... but even if a CVA was as much as 20p in the £...they would only get 5m...but a CVA is actually more likely to be around 10p in the £ , giving them 2.5m.
Also, as the main creditor, ticketus can refuse to enter into a CVA.
So unless they agreed to a CVA of 40p in the £, which gives you the 10m, then the ticketus thing just doesnt add up, and if it was 40p (no chance) we would be liquidated in A MONTH.
Chase Whyte for the money?, the court has already stated that ticketus are a Rangers creditor.
This all looks promising, until ticketus refuse the CVA,then...all over, no where to go.
Don't mean to be negative, so let's have some other takes on this.

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Nope I completely agree with you, this bid makes absolutely no sense in any shape or form, it hasn't a hope in hell of working even if they are given preferred bid status. What the F*** is going on here

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It's my belief that Ticketus are indeed chasing Whyte. He may hand over shares as compensation of some kind. That makes them adversaries of TBK, who also want CW's shares. It could get messy yet, either that or TBK know exactly what's going on with Ticketus.

The styles of the two groups are quite different. London private equity investment banker types dealing with less refined, maverick entrepeneurs. Not surprising they ended their relationship.

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There was never going to be a CVA

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Well is it worth a try. Cos no-one else wants to know. It does seem to set alarm bells ringing though. Well await the next chapter. Of doom!

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Rangers Poker - game still being played

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Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but IF Rangers lose the big tax case then they will look for hmrc to agree to a cva.now they have to act in the tax payers interests and recoup as much money as possible so will accept rather than getting nothing from liquidation.this agreement with hmrc will give the 25% creditors acceptance vote and Rangers will be able to exit administration VIA a cva.

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Whyte is personally responsible for the Ticketus money if Rangers renege. That sounds like good news but it isnt because Whyte holds the so called 'floating charge' on RFC assets because he paid off the bank debt (how he paid it off is irrelevent).

The way the bank debt was structured was that they held the floating charge on RFC assets and when Whyte paid up the floating charge transfered to him.

Ticketus obviously believe that the potential new owners wouldnt give them as much of a return on their money (which they paid in good faith) as liquidating the club and getting their money back from Whyte.

There was never realistically going to be a CVA. There are just too many creditors who will be unwilling to accept a tiny fraction of what they are owed and then watch Rangers carry on as if nothing has happened in a season or two.

Rapid Vienna have already stated that they are not interested in a CVA and want to be paid in full or they will be going to UEFA.
HMRC have a policy (well documented, details on the website) of not accepting CVAs when tax evasion has occured (this wont be confirmed until the FTT returns its verdict but there are very few legal exerts holding out much hopes of a not guilty verdict).
Now it seems Ticketus have joined that camp as well.

I'm afraid the CVA d avoiding administration scenario has just been grandstanding from TBK, it would take a bona fide miracle for that situation to come about in my opinion. I would like Rangers to survive as they are but I cant see it happening.

Mac {Ed022's Note -

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Who the f**k is running ticketus why buy tickets for the next 4 seasons when we're facing a tax case with hmrc which if we lose could liquidated us and as for hmrc we could o you 75 million + and you stand by and let us run up another 9 million bill

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A CVA is never on the cards. this is all stage management now guys. Theyre drip feeding you the bad news and youre gradually accepting it....just look at this site since February. More and more accepting liquidation / div 3 / newco etc. Theyve played you like flutes and youve bought it. Not long now till they finally tell you youre finished, finito, caput, down the swannee, you have ceased to be, you are an ex football club. They had to do it that way to rein in the nutters.

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I believe BK has taken the place of Ticketus in TBKs consortium, and they have done a deal with Ticketus as long as they deliver the shares of CW.

Too many coincidences, Ticketus out of TBKs and BK in the TBKs, the story Ticketus gave out today doesn't smell right.

I think a deal has been done.

Anorak.

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Ticketus obviously believe that the potential new owners wouldnt give them as much of a return on their money (which they paid in good faith) as liquidating the club and getting their money back from Whyte.
---------------------------------------

I agree but there is an alternative scenario, TBks and BK have done a deal with Ticketus guaranteeing them all their money on condition they deliver CWs shares.

Something is going on with Ticketus, they made no mention of how they intend to recover their investors money, which I find odd.

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There going to get it back through craig whyte sdm cw+ticketus which 1 is the biggest crook i wonder

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Nope I believe Tcketus has been sorted behind closed doors, and CW will hand over his shares for a pound to BK-TBK, and prove everybody wrong.
CW does not want to liquidate Rangers to save his money, this is an exit strategy which has him coming out smelling of roses.

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Ticketus & HMRC are owed more than 25% of the debt and will block a CVA.
Ticketus will get more from WHYTEY'S garauntees & HMRC have bigger fish to fry. LIQUIDATION looms. face up to it & move on as a new co in SFL3 , regain the respect of the other clubs & in time return to your rightful place at the top end of scottish football. as a celtic supporter I will not miss your club as it stands to-day but I will miss the derby games. Sort out the mess you are in and clean up your act and work to regain the respect of others in scottish football. 3-1 top celtic on sunday

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"Something is going on with Ticketus, they made no mention of how they intend to recover their investors money, which I find odd." - A big shiny f*** off stadium in Govan, my old mucker. Rangers are the stadium. The newco aiunt gonnae be able to rent out hampden forever.

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Ticketus are not interested in stadiums, nor are they interested in getting tied up in liquidation courts for years, with all the lovely bad publicity.
Nope, Ticketus were very eager to broker a deal in which they gave concessions to two bidders.This suggests a strong desire to settle out of court, and I believe they have come to an arrangement with the consortium and a redeemed Crag Whyte.


HMRC will be offered 7-8 million unde a CVA or nothing, they will agree to the CVA.

There is one policy at HMRC that overrides all other policies, the interests of the tax payer are paramount. I do not see how losing 200 jobs and 8 million pounds is a justifiable price to pay for a deterrent that did no harm to the owner.
No one can deny the mesage against EBTs has been delivered loud and clear over the last 70 odd days, most owners see the threat of being driven into administration as one and the same as liquidation, they have no control. I believe the message does not NEED to be hammered in at the cost of 8 million pounds and a few hundred jobs.

They will settle.

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"I agree but there is an alternative scenario, TBks and BK have done a deal with Ticketus guaranteeing them all their money on condition they deliver CWs shares.

Something is going on with Ticketus, they made no mention of how they intend to recover their investors money, which I find odd."

Look. The last thing I want to do is be all doom and gloom but ticketus own the right to 100,000 future season tickets which they bought for 25 million ish. Can anyone tell me how much a season ticket is at Ibrox costs? £400 ish? That equates to £40 million owed to them if the deal goes ahead. I think rather than gamble on two different bunches of charlatans they have decided just to take their original investment back via Whyte and liquidation and chalk this one up to experience.

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"I agree but there is an alternative scenario, TBks and BK have done a deal with Ticketus guaranteeing them all their money on condition they deliver CWs shares.

Something is going on with Ticketus, they made no mention of how they intend to recover their investors money, which I find odd."

Look. The last thing I want to do is be all doom and gloom but ticketus own the right to 100,000 future season tickets which they bought for 25 million ish. Can anyone tell me how much a season ticket is at Ibrox costs? £400 ish? That equates to £40 million owed to them if the deal goes ahead. I think rather than gamble on two different bunches of charlatans they have decided just to take their original investment back via Whyte and liquidation and chalk this one up to experience.

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HMRC couldn't care less if you go bust!How many times do you have to be told your club is the test case for other clubs ie pay up or we,ll do an rfc on ye...And if your goni make up stories about CVA,s and ticketus read scotslawthoughts from a legal expert and the answers always the same Bust,finito no way out.No fairy stories just The End.

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27 Apr 2012 17:19:43
I will buy rangers if if if
No further on,dnp will stall
Then we see everybody hand apart from whytes,
I no for a fact that whyte owns yours assets in a company name that is insolvent now on to mc,
Whyte shares is not only thing that people will struggle of them,
Expect his shares to be in his dads name,

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Blue knights and blue days

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27 Apr 2012 17:05:17
Most ridiculous gesture yet by Kennedy and Murray. They have failed on two counts. 1. There will be no CVA and two CRAIG WHYTE STILL OWNS THE DAM CLUB!! I said it last week and was slated but it has come to pass. Rangers will have no prefered bidder announced until May after the clubs meet on Monday. They will run out of money by the end of May. Administrators will move to liquidate . Rangers will form a newco in another division under a different name. The tax case will be decided as a rangers error and they will have to pay all monies forcing their closure. Basically everyone gets screwed, the fans the players and management, the workers, the people we shamefully owe so much money too, the tax payers. We are a shameful excuse for a club. We either need some big hearted fans or Donald Trump to go round clearing off some of these debts we owe for a chance at decency and to rebuild our name. SDM You should be ahsamed of yourself. Craig Whyte I admire your ability to spot a bargain as you will actually get a load from the liquidation of rangers. Although I don't knnow if you would be too welcome in your homeland again.
Gaz

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You have hit the nail on the head. Rangers need a benefactor prepared to donate a huge amount of money to get them out of this mess.
Liah Smit

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Very well summed up Gaz I believe you have it in one!

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It's D&P's job to get Rangers out of administration by either (i) selling the club, (ii) returning it to solvency or (iii) liquidating it. They act on behalf of creditors but yes, CW owns the shares still. If he digs in and refuses to hand them over then liquidation is the only outcome. But I can't see why he would do that. He's holding out for an offer, probably from Ticketus who he owes a lot of money probably.

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Great post mate, its about time more people started pointing the finger at SDM.

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I think you are SPOT ON !

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Gaz,

I agree with most of your post except CW will get little to nothing out of liquidation, he only put in a £1 and his shares are liquidated to worthess, he is not even a creditor.

CW will not liquidate unless he is forced to, if he can get Ticketus off his back, then its a CVA.


I think the deal is done.

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Big Tax Case---lose it, HMRC don't do CVAs where wilful tax dodging concerned. All the bids/non bids/conditional bids,sanctions etc are secondary to the verdict on the tax owed. The only way to pay off the millions that are involved are for either a cash injection by wealthy benefactor(s) or complete sale of all assets which still might not clear the debt. That means liquidation. Its the tax case and always has been the tax case that matters. Win it and THEN the rest of the debts become, with negotiation and sufficient time frame, surmountable which would likely encourage some investment as there would be a long term pay-off eventually. BUT if that tax comes due none of the present bidders will be willing or able to take on the liability so the need for a super-white knight or liquidation.

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Craig Whytes shares always have value in an administration. Even in liquidation he gets a share of the pot because he holds the selling rights to any of the brand held by the shares.

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Hey guys lay of craig whyte i for one would welcome him back to his homeland any time he wishes to visit, so speak for yourself you arrogant little man .,.,,.kbarry

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27 Apr 2012 17:04:08
Don't want to be a prophet of doom but although glad TBK and Kennedy have submitted their bid, I cannot possibly see how a CVA can be agreed, given that Ticketus are out and now become the major creditor and have today stated they prefer liquidation. Throw into the mix having to acquire Whytes shares then I think it's futile. We may end up with the TBK but I can only see them taking control after eventual liquidation with them stating well we tried first...thoughts fellow bears?

Believable12 Unbelievable3

At no point did they say they prefered liquidation, they stated that it was impossible to agree terms with the potential bidders but still believed murray had the clubs best interest at heart, nothing more

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Even with Kennedy on board I think they will run out of money that he iswilling to spend. Lets face things FOOTBALL IS A MONEY PIT only people like SDM looking for a dream will waste such amounts of money in a vain attempt to grasp that dream.

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I've thought similar myself. I actually think if club was to be liquidated other parties would show interest. No-one wants to be the one to do it though. I think it will be liquidation. Hope not.

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Not having ticketus on board will be a stumbling block and c w cant see a cva being done at this stage

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27 Apr 2012 16:37:08
Paul Murray's Blue Knights and Brian Kennedy have joined forces to submit a new bid to take control of Rangers.

Ticketus, who had been part of the Blue Knights group, earlier withdrew their commitment to funding a takeover bid.

But Murray and Kennedy negotiated a partnership and a statement on behalf of the duo read: "This offer we consider to be substantial.

"[The offer] is conditional on a CVA being approved by the creditors, and Mr [Craig] Whyte's shares being acquired."

Murray and Kennedy added: "We hope this is accepted so that we may proceed with due diligence forthwith and make a start to the task of re-building Rangers Football Club of 1872. "

Source: BBC

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Goodnight Vienna then. CW has them by the short and curlies.

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So much for no conditions? IF we get a CVA, IF we get Whyte's shares, IF the administrators accept our bid?

Can you see a pattern emerging here....IF.

They have not got the funds to deal with all the debt involved in the long term....

Sanctions again Monday and then within the month the Big Tax Case will be known.

Biffo the Bear

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Defo would be good for rangers bk and blue kights have the best intrests of the club at heart

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That will be that deal dead then. Craig Whyte not interested no CVA will be done by ticketus or HMRC so well it was nice knowing you but all good things well you know the rest. I can feel a Vera Lynn song coming on come Sunday

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I think this offer is just 'spin' so that the Blue Knights can be seen to have made one final try at a CVA. But we all know Tciketus will not accept their offer, nor will CW. But the Blue Knights will be seen to have made one final try. When it is rejected, expect the Liquidation process to start.

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Won't happen Kennedy has been advised by people not to go into a consortium. Cva wont be agreed anyway. BK don't have enough money especially with Ticketus gone.

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Please get rid off ticketus for rangers sake

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27 Apr 2012 16:32:52
If the crux of the RFC argument is that the 12 months transfer embargo impedes the sale of the club. Does a Kennedy/TBK unconditional bid today not undermine that arguement, in which case the appeal is a waste of time?

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It may be conditional on a resolution of this transfer embargo

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Their bid is conditional duh!

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..It certainly hinders the sale of the club...but i think the "krux" of the appeal is based on why have other clubs that have gone into administration in the recent past only been barred from signing players while in administration...if its because of Rangers owing the HMRC then it should have applied to Motherwell...Dundee..Airdie...Livingston..Gretna etc as well because every last one of them went into admin owing the taxman!....thats why us bears feel it is victimisation...

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Written reasons have't been released yet, so appeal is actually premature. If the main reason for the embargo transpires to be non payment of football creditors, then RFC will have to fall on their sword I'm afraid and the appeal will fail. RFC have sold on players that they haven't paid for in the first place, so they need hammered on the transfer front for those. UEFA will accept no less, or there could be potential defaults across Europe without some sort of deterrent.

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Victimisation? Of those five clubs, two went out of business (current Airdrie is newco buying Clydebank). Dundee and Livi weren't in the SPL but suffered huge penalties. Motherwell was yonks ago and rules about footy clubs have been tightened since then. I think also that Motherwell paid their tax but I may be mistaken.

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"Motherwell...Dundee..Airdie...Livingston..Gretna etc as well because every last one of them went into admin owing the taxman!....thats why us bears feel it is victimisation"

But they didnt intentionally withhold money due to the taxman.

Rangers have been hit with a transfer ban because they have not paid for players they have purchased. In several cases Rangers bought players knowing full well that there was a very good chance of not being able to pay for them. At best that was extremely irresponsible if not downright amoral and mercenary.

Given the list of punishments available to the SFA and the seriousness of the charges I cant believe that Rangers fans and figureheads think that they have been hard done by. Expulsion from league and or cups was on that list. Rangers being hit with a transfer ban is unlikely to affect them much as they are in administration at the moment and whichever way they leave it they are unlikely to have transfer funds available for a long time.

Mac

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TBK and BK bid is not dependent on SPL and/ or punishments.... Good point.
Miller went to the media and was quoted immediately after SFA announced punishments that they would not affect his bid.

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27 Apr 2012 16:00:18
Good luck to brian kennedy and the blue knights who have submited a written offer to take over rangers football club, it should be applauded that brian kennedy has stuck to his word, and the blue knights who have cemented the saying, we dont do walking away, god bless them..........is today to be the turning point?........

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Devil will be in the detail. needs to be better than Miller's in respect of CVA pot.

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Probably not.

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TBK already walked away once and Kennedy's approach has been tentative at the least, let's not get carried away and declare them the new messiahs quite yet.

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Agreed, I hope BK and Blue Knights get preffered bidder status, i just fear whyte wont sell shares at right price and scupper all the hard work....hopefully our tunning point but not out of the woods yet. WATP

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Fingers crossed that this bid is accepted

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27 Apr 2012 15:55:19
Various media outlets reporting that official bid from TBK's/Brian Kennedy was lodged @ 3pm....awaiting press release.

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True - subject to a CVA being agreed and the acquisition of Whytes' shares

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Ur right, jut heard it on radio clyde. yipee!

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It's on the BBC website. There's ONLY two conditions:
1. Whytes shares are made available to them.
2. All Creditors accept a CVA.

No probs there then.

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Various media outlets owed money from Rangers.

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Think any new owner of Rangers should purchase Parkhead, make it a 5 star stadium whilst they are at it. More chance of Rangers filling it than that lot.

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NO CVA as ticketus now prefer liquidation rather than 10p/£.

How does that help?

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Ticketus will be in the background ....they will sue whytee for the millions unless he hands over the shares...hes as guilty as sin and legally must conform otherwise he will be in big s*** on all fronts......deecee...ps...silly wee man

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No such thing as a 5 star stadium now - UEFA did away with that system.

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Whyte will not/may not have to conform - you hope he will but where has hoping he'd conform got you in the past?

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27 Apr 2012 15:54:27
BK'S submit bid....ssn....jsm

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27 Apr 2012 14:23:26
rangers will have new owners in place by monday(talksport) some good news at last!

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And of course we have to wait over ANOTHER weekend

wheres the spanner coming frpm this time????

bill72

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Might be a prefered bidder by monday, deals don't go through that quick

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For Heaven's sake. the best we can hope for is that they will be declared preferred bidders by Monday.

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Bill Miller and Dave King believe liquidation is inevitable. The BKs are building their hopes on getting an agreement to a CVA of as little as 1p in the pound! No chance - one way or another liquidation is coming and Ally will get his moral wish to play in Div 3 (if their bid is successful!!)

PS - Whyte will only agree to any deal that makes him money!

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Thought it was by the end of today.

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Did they say what MONDAY if Duff & Duffer we're talking about here it could be any Monday you need to get a month and year off them

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Cva is not going to be as little as a penny in the pound sources close to the blue knights say a cva will be agreed to pay creditors between 15 and 20 pence in the pound and no players will be signed next season if we are in the spl still and even if the transfer embargo is lifted. blue knights looking to secure current squad but only one player thought to be leaving that is kyle lafferty back to burnley for £650'000 which will be used towards cva. any players brought in if embargo is lifted will be loan players from championship clubs who wont attract higher than £5000 a week wages. rangers will be looking to rebuild over the next 2 or 3 years hopefully getting into the europa league to generate money. no chance of champions league as wont be able to win qualifying ties should we finish second in the league. future not as bleak as looked earlier in week but still a long way to go. all i add now is the march tommorrow please no violence as we do not need any more negative press. onwards and upwards.

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Does the fair play out come not come out on Monday? hmmmm another hurdle to get over....this season is sure finishing quickly, then what will happen?

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If any new owner secures the current squad with no Europe, then they will lose £1 million pounds a month, just like SDM and CW.

To suggest the CVA will offer creditors 20p on the pound is nonsense, the secured creditors take the first 40million, 20p on the poond on the balance of 100 million puts the total offer at 60 million.

The offers were around 11-20 million ...now its 60 mllion after the sanctions.

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To poster above. What about CW shares?

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Isn't Monday the same day as the SPL disciplinary findings are revealed?

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And what about the current players who's wages are deferred - what happens when they go back up to 100%?

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There will be no new owners on Monday, there may be a preferred bidder on Monday and their bid will be put to the creditors after the BTC debt is formalised.

And they may not agree and prefer liquidation, there is a long way to go.

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All that missing is the warchest then?

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The same talksport that Keith 'Off the Radar' Jackson works for? Take this with a pinch of salt lads. It would be nice if it was true but dont build your hopes up too much.

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There are 52 mondays in a year i wonder which 1 it will be {Ed022's Note - Rangersrumours, the official home of Mondays.}

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27 Apr 2012 13:45:26
Source : Evening Times..
THE Blue Knights and Brian Kennedy are close to an agreement that would see them submit a joint bid to save Rangers from liquidation.

Mr Kennedy met members of the Paul Murray-led Blue Knights' consortium during five hours of discussions.

It is believed the framework of an equal partnership agreement is in place after what one source described as "an extremely productive and constructive meeting".

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It's just the start, and probably the best hope too. But will this be enough for the creditors?

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What about the WHITE NIGHT hovering in the background,he is not going to disapear,

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Have they made a bid and paid the £500k

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What part of Murray does not have the funds to pull us out of the situation and Kennedy really does not want to be involved do you not get.....?

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What part of this does not involve Celtic fans. Why the constant need to be a part of what is going on at Ibrox.

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I am afraid the bid will not be accepted by the main creditors HMRC and Ticketus unless it is in the region of 50 million.

CW is now liable for the Ticketus debt and unless the offer clears this debt he will want 27 milion for his shares.

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Ticketus will block. Cva

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27 Apr 2012 13:37:44
RANGERS fans are to spend around £20,000 on hiring one of Scotland's top QCs to fight the Scottish Football Association's fine and ban on the club signing players

Richard Keen, QC, the Dean of the Faculty of Advocates, who successfully defended one of the men accused of the Lockerbie bombing, is understood to have been approached to represent the club at an appeal.

He will be paid by the Rangers Fighting Fund, which was set up to receive donations from ordinary fans after the club went into administration in February.

The move is fully supported by administrators Duff & Phelps following Monday's £160,000 fine and 12-month embargo on signing players, for bringing the game into disrepute after Craig Whyte's takeover last May.

Andy Kerr, of the Rangers Supporters' Assembly, said: "There was a strong body of opinion that we have to challenge this decision but we need the expertise to do so.

"The fighting fund is going to support that and the expertise will be essential if we are to get the expedited appeal that we want.

"We can shout and bawl and jump up and down but the way that we can address the appeal is to get the necessary legal representation."

Mr Kerr said there was up to £500,000 available from personal donations, fundraising events and the sale of rosettes, scarves and pin badges.

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Were getting seen by all other clubs that we can not take our punishment, yes its unfair but we do need to take our punishment. the fact is like it or not , our club broke the rules . We need this mess put to bed an move on or every club in scotland will look at us as tainted at everything we have done

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£500K Mr Keen will be rubbing his hands with glee!

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£20k that could have been better clearing some of the smaller creditors off the list. Priorities are so wrong. Only ones making money out of this mess is the RFC directors, high maintenance players, accountants and solicitors.

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Soooooo - RFC finally catching onto the CFC mentality of engaging legal experts from now on to challenge everything the SPL/SFA throw at them

could be interesting times

bill72

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Just whats needed now another drain on Rangers finances albeit from the fighting fund.
That money was supposd to aid Rangers in their quest and to help pay the ordinary person for goods and services provided in good faith but no lets line the pockets of another lawyer

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Like I said all along the winners in this are the Lawyers. If you think the Rangers Admin is a scandal This kind of crap goes on all day every day.

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I hope the Hector fans intend only only to do this within the SFA system....try doing a sion, and you will be even more hated by your actions than you currently are....you will have no friends if you take this punishment to the courts and get sanctions taken against other scottish clubs as a result of your behaviour....

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Will it cover legal costs and fines for anyone arrested at this march from Queens Park? Because things are so heated some will lose the plot!

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The one thing that saddens me about the fighting fund is that essentially the money wiil wasted on legal/ accountant fees etc when any number of charities would love to be able to have raised £500k & spend it in a truly worthwhile casue. Instead ordinary fans money is being used to to make up for the faults of (the very rich) directors & chairmen whose financial (& fraudulent) mismanagement casued this. I dont see SDM or martin bain using their own cash to help - no chance of that, only the poor mugs who cant afford it. Rangers fans would do well & get more credit & satisfaction to donate the rasied cash to a childrens hospital.

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I have to confess it will be very difficult for the SFA to prove improper goverrnance in a court of law. In effect they are saying CW intentionally ran the company into the ground when he had other alernatives. Using HMRC contributions as working capital is not improper conduct unless the owner is lining his own pockets.

I bellieve CW when he says he never took a penny from the company, which means he didn't pay HMRC for good reason and there was no alternative open to him.

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Uefa will be very displeased at this direction taken.

Remember Sion

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£20,000? should last 2 days for legal costs

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Truely pathetic. The fighting fund should pay off all the small businesses. Spending £20k on a QC to fight a justifiable sanction from your professional body that is enforcing rules that you signed upto is galatically stupid.

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Agree with previous post. £20,000 will not get you much more than a quick read over and a couple of query letters written.

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"Truely pathetic. The fighting fund should pay off all the small businesses. Spending £20k on a QC to fight a justifiable sanction from your professional body that is enforcing rules that you signed upto is galatically stupid."

Love it. +1

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27 Apr 2012 13:34:41
STV reporting that in 2001 Ally McCoist put his name to a computer football game that offers players the risk of tax dodging....
However, given the current state of Rangers, McCoist may regret lending his name to a game which appears to offer the opportunity for wannabe Directors of Football to avoid paying tax. At the end of each in-game season your club is presented with a tax bill, but you can decide to risk further repurcussions by only paying a fraction of the money owed.

The screen reads: "You can reduce the amount of tax by 50 percent, at the risk of being caught and facing a large fine. Do you wish to adopt this tax evasion?" {Ed001's Note - here is a link to the story: http://sport.stv.tv/blog/305161-ally-mccoist-football-video-game-contains-tax-dodge/ bizarre this is!}

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He should consider his position what next!

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Just read the link, on the basis it isn't April 1st have to assume article is true, therefore this has really cheered me up at the end of a bad week. Sheer brilliance! There's only one Super Ally

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Did you get an EBT Ally?

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So he knew all along even back in 2001.

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And ........what does this contribute to the wider debate ? {Ed001's Note - nothing, it is just odd that he put his name to a game that suggests that as an option.}

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It was a game not the real thing. For goodness sake he made some cash putting his name to a computer game not with the intent of cheating the taxman. Even actors cash in on tough guy images etc. (I am a Tim supporter but lets stay practical here)

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To hold this against Ally is ridiculous. Famous footballers get paid to have their names put on computer games, doesnt mean he went to the game manufactor and said "we really should have a tax evasion option in this game"!

Do you think Jimmy White went to the manufactors of his snooker game and said "I really would appreciate it if you could make this game terrible"?

Mac

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Folks are supposed to check products before recommending them. This story suggests two things: 1. Tax evasion is endemic in football and accepted. 2. We are teaching our kids about it in games as an acceptable risk strategy.
I thought the government vetted this kind of stuff and didn't let it happen.
Finally McCoist I'd making money from something wholly unsuitable for children.

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27 Apr 2012 13:28:00
THE Blue Knights and Brian Kennedy are close to an agreement that would see them submit a joint bid to save Rangers from liquidation..
Mr Kennedy met members of the Paul Murray-led Blue Knights' consortium during five hours of discussions.

It is believed the framework of an equal partnership agreement is in place after what one source described as "an extremely productive and constructive meeting".

Mr Kennedy, whose personal wealth has been estimated at up to £250million, owns Sale Sharks rugby union club, in Greater Manchester.

He and the Rangers-supporting businessmen who comprise the Blue Knights consortium would combine elements of their financial offers in an attempt to rescue the crisis-torn Ibrox club.

The Knights and Mr Kennedy have been mutually appreciative of their separate bids until now, but while Mr Kennedy had previously said he would support the Knights' attempts to save Rangers he is now understood to be close to a far more substantial financial commitment.

If a reconstructed bid is formalised it could be lodged with the club's administrators, Duff '& Phelps, within days.

American businessman Bill Miller continues to monitor the unfolding events around Ibrox and has drafted an £11.2m bid, which involves the creation of a "newco" club.

But it is expected the Knights/Kennedy consortium will move quickly because they realise the club is teetering on the brink of liquidation after the latest delays in the bidding process.

The value of a Kennedy/ Knights offer has still to be established, but both parties were previously prepared to pay about £10m to buy Rangers and take the club out of administration via a Company Voluntary Arrangement (CVA).

Monday was supposed to have been the deadline for naming a preferred bidder to take the club out of Craig Whyte's control.

However, Duff & Phelps had to extend that after the Scottish Football Association Judicial Panel's punishment for rule-breaking by Rangers.

The panel fined the club £160,000 and banned it from signing any player older than 18 for a year – and that again delayed any acceptable offers from being tabled.

Mr Kennedy has been a constant presence throughout the Rangers' takeover saga, but despite making two bids to own the club on his own he has cast himself as an outside candidate who wanted control only if there was a danger of liquidation.

The Hibs' supporter, who said he hoped to save Rangers as an institution in Scottish life, had publicly applauded the Blue Knights' takeover efforts from the outset.

Both Mr Kennedy and the Knights have said they were against the one-man ownership model that has put Rangers into such a grave position. It would be likely Mr Kennedy and each of the Knights would have a say on any new board of directors if their bid was successful.

The major hurdle for Mr Kennedy/the Blue Knights or Mr Miller to clear is how to get Mr Whyte's 85.3% shareholding.

London-based agency Ticketus has said it can do a deal with Mr Whyte to deliver those shares, but so far his demands have proved to be excessive.

Mr Miller has refused to deal with Ticketus or Mr Whyte but the agency is still in talks with the Blue Knights.

Mr Miller is reluctant to commit to an unconditional bid until he knows the full extent of the punishments Rangers could face from the football authorities, but the SPL's investigation into alleged undisclosed payments to players will continue for several more weeks.

Despite claims that they had withdrawn entirely from the bidding process, it is also understood that Club 9 Sports, the American sports investment company, has continued to advise Mr Miller.

Evening Times

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Whyte's n umber one priority is loadsa money for Whyte.

He doesn't have any other priorities!

He'll liquidate you.

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I've been praying for you so let's hope its true. Aloysius

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D&P seem to be doing very nicely out of all these extensions etc. I hope CW is not getting anything from this

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27 Apr 2012 13:03:53
Blue Knights and Brian Kennedy will have a bid accepted for Rangers today
my m8 Says its 98% Certain and hes been Spot on with his Info so Far .Norrieboy

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I'm a 100% certain it wont be done today or any-time soon.

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Hope your mate is right, would be over the moon.

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D&P are in no position to accept a bid from anyone. This is just the start of a process which may or may not lead to a successful CVA. Then there's the minor matter of CW's shares.

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2% doubt
enough for me not bet on it - given the way things have been going

bill72

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27 Apr 2012 12:16:53
Ally says administrators have told him they are very close to a deal. haven't confirmed who with or if it will result in a CVA but promising news all the same. Source Rangers website.

( hopefully this isn't more bulls**tting from D&P)

Smith0069

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D&P have stated they are close to naming a preferred bidder to get exclusivity, awaiting electronic transfer of £500k to clear from USA.

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You WILL NOT get CVA. HMRC and Ticketus are huge creditors and they will be at the top table to strip the assets and get much more than they would with a CVA. You are fecked. Whoopee! There is a God!

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Its brian kennedy and we will be out of adminastration today 6pm offically

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DP have always said that any offers must be UNCONDITIONAL. Murray saying that his joint offer with Kennedy has VERY FEW CONDITIONS. Will DP change their minds? Doubt it. It has to be Miller or Ticketus putting Rangers into liquidation.

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VERY FEW CONDITIONS......

the offer for the club between murray and kennedy could be unconditional.

even if there are conditions in the agreement between the 2 they are working out, the conditions could be who has a bigger say on events at the club or conditions for kennedy being bought out after so long for a set price once everything is sorted, these conditions can be anything,

but wouldnt effect the unconditional offer for the club

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With even possibly greater sanctions in the pipeline they must be willing to gamble millions!

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Miller has bid £11.4m bid, Kennedy previously £2m? And TBK nowt not even £500k only talk about ticketus debt.
How can Kennedy and TBK now have more than £11.4m?

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Think about bit.
What might happen on Saturday(poss demo) and Sunday if no bid was entered.
This news is a defuser for this weekend.
Still got to get the EBT bad results and the SFL punishment.
No genuine bid would be excepted or submitted without knowing the final picture. Unless the objective is to Liquidize no matter what.

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To above poster, I read that HMRC don't geet preferential treatment in admin cases. They're a creditor long with everyone else. That would change things. Anyone else know if that's is true?

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Good to see these idiots got what they deserve. While I'm not a fan of Neil Lennon I believe he is just passionate about his job and his team. He needs to be more controlled in future but obviously does not deserve what these guys did.

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Can't see anyone puting an unconditional bid in today when they don't know Monday's SPL sanctions yet.

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We cant come out of admin to day if they pay the £500k they have 2 weeks to see the full amount of debt ..and they cant see tht till the ebt case comes through .but it does look as if its going the right way

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Why didnt ally demand to know who they were

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So to the poster who states that we will be out of Administration by 6pm tonight?. So in that time we will have completed a due diligence exclusivity check, agreed a CVA with all creditors, sorted the tax issues, made Craig Whyte transfer his shares, sucessfully appealed SFA sanctions and been assured by SPL that there is to be no further charges. I take my hat off to D&P, they are good after all...or maybe your just an idiot.

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Out of admistration at 6.00pm !! ahaha. give us some of your medication.are all bills being paid today? no. so you will not be out of admin

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I read that the SFA would appoint an indepenDent QC to hear any Rangers appeal.
Since a noted QC was part of the panel, I don't think these bedfellows from the faculty of advocates are even allowed to contradict each other.

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To the Hector who posted you will be out of admin by 6pm...This is just the first step in a long road....no magic wands...just some serious discussions of what next steps need to be done to safe Rangers.....think you will be a very disappointed little Hector post 6pm.

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Just got info that ueafa has stepped in to be neautral panel for rangers sfa appeal they will conduct this appeal next week. the only thing for rangers is that ueafa will be more severe as rangers have broken a lot of the govverning bodies rules and the owe a lot of transfer monies to different clubs. This could get even more serious for rangers as ueafa are more stringent with their rules. {Ed001's Note - highly unlikely, UEFA are not looking to get involved unless they have to. I assume you mean them anyway.}

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UEFA will only step in if they believe the punishment doesn't match the crime (too lenient) or if RFC went through the civil courts to try and obtain a legal remedy.

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27 apr 2012 11:34:16
ssn breaking news,,,,,,blue nights to make official bid today,,,,,,,,also heard throught the grapevine that ticketus are on boards along with brian kennedy

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. Total pish. Is that why Ticketus are all over the rpess announcing that they;ve withdrawn from the bid?

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You should read the news

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Ticketus have withdrawn, they will
B looking for a court session to liquidate rangers and sell the assets to fund the loand money, its well on the cards

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Many online internet news reports suggesting that ticketus have definitely pulled out-they've issued statement and everything. I think BK and Brian Kennedy are now on an even footing with Bill Miller because ticketus are no longer involved. I think they will win the bid but in winning the bid (like Miller similarly planned) they will have no choice but to put the club into liquidation through no fault of their own but because there is a line of people that can't be dealt with (HMRC/Ticketus?Whyte). I think liquidation is inevitable but with the knights on board they can be the ones to rebuild from the ashes rather than the american.I don't view BK and Brian Kennedy's bid as positive, i view it as one step closer to a necessery liquidation.That's not something we can celebrate really is it?!!!Monday could be a dark day but at least if they push those sanctions through we'll stay in the spl when we liquidate :(

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Ticketus has pulled out - brian kennedy thought to be in talks though

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Its liquidation unless they pay CW 27 million for his shares.

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Dunno where you saw that. Most sites reporting Ticketus have pulled out - can't agree with TBK on what is best both for Ticketus' investors and for the bid. Sounds like they'll try their luck when it comes to a CVA or liquidation.

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Meant to also say that Ticketus look like they're going after Craig Whyte as he provided personal security for the money, which as we know is no longer there because it went to Lloyds to pay off the debts. Ticketus could end up with CW's shares.

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Ticketus have withdrawn from the Blue Knights consortium's bid to buy Rangers after failing to reach an agreement for its investors.

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"but at least if they push those sanctions through we'll stay in the spl when we liquidate :("
--

Why should we stay in the SPL, purely to subsidise other teams intent on ensuring our destruction. Go to the 3rd division, let the SPL deal with the ramifications, we will return to the SPL stronger than if we stay in it with the penalties in place.

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If you read ticketus statement it states they can no longer be part of the consortium at this stage

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I am afraid that the Big Hoose is going to turn into Bleak Hoose, as we settle down to a re-run of Jarndyce v Jarndyce, and there is feck all we can do about it!

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Ticketus cant apply for use to be liqudated, Whyte borrowed the money, not Rangers, Also what they did is technically illegal.

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The only reason Rangers are going into Liqidation is because no "bidder" is prepared to pay of the debts. By the sound of it not one bid would have brought in anything to a CVA. And none of them could see how to run the club at without loosing £10million a year. Liquidation means everything get sold to the highest bidder, It is possible that someone might buy the whole club lock stock and barrel for £10 million, but really unlikely. I would expect the club, assets, etc to raise upwards of £50m and it is highly possible that the assets might go to different bidders. In which case there could be more than 1 new co trying to get into the SPL. I would also anticipate lots of legal wrangling about who owns what and who is owed what. We could see court injunctions placed on assets including Ibrox pending court action. Liquidation is NOT a better option. Yes the buyers dont inhertit debts (or technically punishments from the SFA etc) but invariably the emerging comany is a lot weaker than before. And sometimes a new company does not appear at all

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"but at least if they push those sanctions through we'll stay in the spl when we liquidate :("
--

Why should we stay in the SPL, purely to subsidise other teams intent on ensuring our destruction. Go to the 3rd division, let the SPL deal with the ramifications, we will return to the SPL stronger than if we stay in it with the penalties in place.

I agree, go to the 3rd division with all the other diddy teams.

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"Ticketus cant apply for use to be liqudated, Whyte borrowed the money, not Rangers, Also what they did is technically illegal."

In which case Ticketus can sue Whyte for it because he has no personal capacity to secure the season tickets which Ticketus believed they were buying.

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Ticketus become a creditor then oppose a cva as meercat says simples !

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27 Apr 2012 11:26:47
The Blue Knights are to submit a official bid for Rangers sometime today SSN

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Is Kennedy texting D&P this time or phoning again.

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Will it be a more attractive option thatn liquidation though? I think not. This mob couldn't even fine the £500k for the deposit. ha.

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Last chance saloon for Paul Murray. Media saying Brian Kennedy is on board too but will it be enough for D&P?

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I take it the issue of 'fit and proper person' in relation to Paul Murray (old board member) has been settled - what do you think ED? {Ed001's Note - I would think that it is possible that he would have to take a back seat and merely be a silent partner. Purely because of those fit and proper person issues relating to him being involved with the previous regime. That is if it would be an issue.}

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Paul Murray and his knights haven't got the money and Kennedy keeps popping up talking s***e, lets face it, without Ticketus on-board or someone with a spare 100+million to give away, the gers are doomed.

one more thing, the last thing Rangers need is guys like Jardine getting involved in demonstrations, these demo's are going to end in tears.

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Yes they may well bid. But how much?. And will it be accepted? Is there a chance they do have more finance than we think but are being shrewd for obvious reasons like getting best value deal? Or are they just fans who are trying their best to do what wed all love to do?

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Paul Murray has always proclaimed himself as the public face of the BK's due to his knowledge of the club....don't think he's ever said if he will be running things afterwards

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27 Apr 2012 11:16:22
Two men jailed for 5 years for sending mail bombs to Neil Lennon- BBC

Good, we don't need those sort of people associating themselves with our club (and they are associated, the picture on BBC has one wearing a Rangers shirt).

Don't get me wrong, I am not a fan of Neil Lennon, (personally I think he is a bully), but nonetheless, nobody deserves to be intimidated in that way.

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I said on here half way through the trial when they changed pleas from attempted murder it would be 5 years, out in three and a half. Nice to be right.

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Well said mate i dont like Neil lennon also he tries to intimadate refs to hide from the facts of his shortcomings as a manager but for that reason only nothing to do with his religion. these 2 guys are a**eholes and just heap more bad press on our club along with the others threatening peole online our club is on its knees at the moment and these people are not doing anyone any favours if they were real fans they would realise that they are just harming us more they are morons

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Bullets and bombs are nothing to do with football these sentences serve as a warning that it won't and should not be tolerated in our society

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OP
Agree - 5 should be 5 though!

Unfortunately NL is a tw*t, and doesn't do anything positive for his teams image - but no way deserved what happened to him

bill72

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Well said Sir!

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Far too low a tariff IMHO

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We don't need these knuckle-draggers associating themselves with Rangers.

Totally deserved punishment.

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Indeed. We support football, not terrorism.

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As a rangers fan i would not like to be associated or for rangers to be associated with these idiots. they got what they desrved - maybe even got off lightly. i am one of neil the neds DISLIKERS but no man should suffer that amount HATE. Also lets not forget trish godman and the late paul mcbride done absolutely nothing wrong but support the other side. nothing which warrants this.

ryanrfc

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As a Celtic supporter I am glad to hear decent gers fans come out with this sort of statement..good luck guys

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Sentence wasn't long enough. Hangings too good for them.

Bluegenius

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The only reason these two scumbags didnt get longer sentences is that the devices werent viable although according to the judges there was intent.

Basically if these guys werent so dumb they would be murderers. 5 years is a joke.

I'm glad Rangers fans are condemning these despicable bigots. We both have these vile elements in our support and the sooner it is stamped out the better. There is no place for sectarian attitudes in the 21st century. Why do some people think its ok to call someone a fen!@n b*st*rd or an or**ge b*st*rd when the same people would be mortified if someone was called a black b*st*rd?

Everytime I'm at Parkhead and I hear someone close to me trying to start a clearly sectarian song I tell them to shut it and its very rare that people sitting close by dont give a thumbs up which says to me that the majority dont want it going on but dont want to say anything. We need to take a more active approach to stamping it out.

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Celtic supporter, the vast majority of bears feel like that, the whole bomb thing was embarrassing and all the gersmen I talked to were raging at being associated with it. duccablue

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To OP i realise what your saying with the statement of them being Rangers Fans as one was wearing a Replica shirt. To me that in no way inclines them to be 100% Rangers fans as any moron can buy and wear a top and be counted as being a FAN. look at what happened in the riots in Manchester fans from other teams know to be trouble makers were in the flurry with official retarded bigots from Scotland. Bigotry IMO only affects bigots. These people deserve a harsher sentence but thats Scottish Law for you theres no incentive not to do crime as the sentence's are so lenient.

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Glad to see Rangers fans condem this treatment of Neil Lennon, although he is porbably hated at Ibrox, no person should have to go through this and I would condem any Celtic fan thinking of doing the same to a Rangers man, no matter how much we hate them.

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These two knuckle draggers got off lightly in my opinion hope this sends out a message to the morons who lag on to our club we dont need your sort as most bears would never endorse this kind of behavour im glad none got hurt

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Good news, lets just hope we dont disgrace ourselves on Sunday as the whole world will be watching

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Nice to read comments from both sides with similar thoughts on this issue. I just hope everyone behaves themselves at Parkhead on Sunday and that we all get home without meeting any trouble on our travels. Keep the head its not worth it and losing it can destroy lives. Sermon over enjoy the game!

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As a rangers fan who wants nothing to do with the old bigotry mob the world is a better place with these two nutters off the streets just a pity the judge saw fit to hand down such a lenient sentence the old firm should be about football not bombs ` cooper boy

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I agree. Don't want this sort of scum associated with rangers. Totally shameful. Not all rangers fans think on this scale. For 99% of us its strictly football.

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I have to say I'm really pleased to see how this news has been received on here. These type of 'fans' do nothing but drag the name of rangers fans down. However, I am sad to see a few knuckle draggers on my fb page defending them. Appalling. Safe to say they are no longer 'friends'. No place in football for these thugs!

I am a 'timmy' but I'd like to say to all you decent gers

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Shouldve been a much heavier punishment imo, these scumbags are not needed in society. Although I dislike Lennon, no man should have to put up with that kind on nonsense, whatever the reason.

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Well said Sir! As a born South African of Scots Descent and Celtic supporter i was never exposed to the hatred and sectarism i see on these pages and the Celtic pages Both clubs have a long history with each other ans are well off with out the Hatred,for the record Im Catholic and My wife is a belfast Protestant

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Totally agree that neil lennon is a total tit,,,,,,,,,but what has it to do with rangers fc,,,rangers have not connected themselves with the two people and the 2 suspects have no connection to rangers,,,,next you will be saying the clown who ran on the park at the hearts was a rangers fan,,,im pretty sure there are lots of idiots who commit hideous crimes support a football team but it would never be mentioned,,,stop connecting it with rangers,,,i despise neil lennon,,,not because he is celtic manager or a catholic but because he is a horrible vile person,,,,end of story

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At the end of the day the rangers support are fed up with these sorts of muppets 5 years was not enough most gers are decent blokes and wouldnt want to see anyone hurt its just a pity that these thugs lag on to our club and sully our name as for these facebook eejits grow up we want nothing to do with you im rangers daft and have family that support both rangers and celtic many freinds who support both teams we love our clubs we love the banter but no way do i endorse hatred or bigotry i wish both managers would get a bit of leeway as the job of being manager is very difficult two young rookie managers have a thought for allister mcoist and neil lennon who get unfair treatment at times bear

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You despise neil lennon?? strong words mate, thats the sort of venom that the 2 guys sitting in the bar-L used

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27 Apr 2012 11:14:12
Just to back up other posts, Kennedy has been in Scotland for the last two days thrashing out details with Paul Murray. It looks pretty good now for a joint takeover by the Blue Knights and Brian Kennedy, which I think could be good news for Rangers. Source: Daily Record

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27 Apr 2012 11:02:56
It's being reported that ticketus are citing the SFA's ban as the reason they are pulling out. They said this decision has devalued the potential of the club. Well done SFA, turkeys voting for Xmas. I thought Ally was OTT with regards to his statement but could be he will be proven to be correct.

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SFA are following the rules also remember the punishment given was at the lower end of the scale.Do Let me put it this way to you.
If lets say a wealthy business person commits a serious crime would you expect him to get of lightly just because he lets say employs 50000 people?
Where do you draw the line

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Ticketus quoted several factors not just SFA ruling, get it right.
SFA have a responsibility to Police the game up here to UEFA standards. It's not the SFAs fault nor should it be their concern if Rangers are in a bidding process at all.

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Why didn't they wait for the results of the appeal? I believe that the fact that the players' contracts have to be restored in full on June 1st also came into it.

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Its probably not just this ban that has influenced their decision, it is future SFA bans for the EBT fiasco. Rangers could face further points deductions, transfer embargos and European bans. As they said, its not worth the risk to the investors, Rangers main avenue for serious profit is Europe and domestic titles, all these sanctions provide obstacles to this profit.

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Guys,
Please stop blaming SFA the language of BBC reporting is awful, they say "BELIEVE" the ban is the reason but Ticketus go on to say:
"Regrettably over the course of this week it became impossible to reconcile these interests with the proposals put forward by the Blue Knights as the terms of a deal became clearer.

"We do not wish to attach any blame to the failure of these talks as, while there have been frustrations on all sides at times, we believe all parties have been acting in good faith to agree terms.

"Paul Murray and the Blue Knights have the interests of the club at heart and we wish them well as they continue to try to secure the best outcome for the club and its fans. We hope that a swift resolution can be found for the club that will enable it to continue to play a leading role in Scottish football."

So basically, the bid is rubbish and the terms are not acceptable, nothing to do with a ban. Just heresay.
Calm, calm,
Nevis

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The Hectors have a one year ban from signing players...not the end of the world...maybe ticketus now see the printing on the wall...and see that the assets are the only way they will get their money back.

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OP is a clown, its nothing to do with the SFA its smoke and mirrors ,I will be very surprised if anyone buys Rangers,and the only ones to blame are RAngers themselves

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See Daily Record website for full statement, SFA and SPL were part of it, but not only reasons. Bottom line though was they couldn't see how they could get a return for their investors by puting more money in the pot. Surprised it's taken them a month to work that one out. So the men of straw (TBK) are now having to find alternative finance via Kennedy. Reading between the lines the whole thing will hinge on being able to 1. purchase CWs shares, 2. put money in pot for CVA and then 3. rely on the fans stumping up dosh for shares to pay for new players next year.

1. CW wants to hold on to 25% - don't see how Kennedy and BK could work with him. In any event, they don't have £20-30m to pay CW.

2. Probably only puting £10m into CVA pot, but that relies on Kennedy beign willing to put most of the cash up and having to share the club with rest of TBKs. HMRC will not agree to the CVA if Whyte still holds on to 25%.

3. Need an additional £10m in working capital to run the club until share issue is done. Are the fans willing to fork out £1,000+ each on top of season tickets to support the club knowing CW is still on scene and do they trust Murray to run the club properly.

Best scenario is TBK win control of Rangers but are back in Administration within 18 months. Worse scenario, liquidation.

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Ticketus could not agree with Paul Murray's continual attempts to force down their repayment terms was how I understand it.

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That's what Ticketus are saying, amongst other things. But if that was the only snag I'm sure Ticketus would still be part of the process. Just a smokecreen I think for the other issues between Ticketus and Paul Murray, who don't seem to be very intimate bedfellows at all.

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I fear they will run out of cash - and back to square one!

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27 Apr 2012 10:43:31
Ticketus Lawyers booking court of session to move to Liquidation and sale of Glasgow Rangers PLC assets.

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Yet another load of garbage, don't print information you know is false, go and get a job and stop watching Jeremy kyle...

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Any odds on Rangers being a no show on Sunday.

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I think that you will find that at a recent court hearing Ticketus were not given preffered creditor status........try again though.

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I wish they would and put us all out of our misery !

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Lol those boys r quick.

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Lets be honest here, if the football club were a horse it would have been put down a long time ago. Please can somebody (anybody!) just end it all now.

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Dont be so quick to rule this out bears, as it stands ticketus are the biggest creditor (since the big tax case verdict hasnt hit yet) so they do have the authority to move for liquidation.

Ticketus know Craig Whyte is on the hook to them for their money, Whyte holds the floating charge on assets (he gets paid first in the event of a liquidation) so if Ticketus can get the company liquidated then Whyte gets the floating charge money, therefore Ticketus recoup their money.

Not a pleasant way to do business but entirely possible. If this is what they have in mind they may even try to force it through before the BTC comes back because HMRC dont have a solid figure yet.

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Above post- correct.
Do you think ticketus are nice guys who will sit back and get fleeced by Gers men for £24.5million? Or a 10pence CVA? No chance.

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No Ticketus do not have creditor status. They are owed Season tickets which if they do not appear would constitute a breach of contract and resultant penalties. d&p have indicated they will forfeit on the deal. That might be enough for them to become creditors, On for the very expensive lawyers to debate

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I think Rangers should field an under 18s team on Sunday, show the world what the state of the SPL will be without them.

RIP Scottish Football.

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27 Apr 2012 10:30:09
ed i posted about a week ago that i thot ticketus were a bit keen to lower there money owed and i thought they maybe didnt fancy there chances of legally getting it bak, now i see rumours that they dont, do u have any info on the matter m8? ntbear {Ed001's Note - the only thing I can find out is pure opinion on the matter. Even that is split between believing they can't get it back and believing they can!}

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If Ticketus were in any doubt of getting their money back through liquidation and CWs floating charge, then they would not be pulling out of the deal.

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First reply is bang on. The lack of credible bidders is the final nail in RFC coffin, Ticketus were more than happy to be involved with bids that treated their investment fairly rather than trying to stiff them the same as the other creditors. Miller, TBK and Kennedy have all apparently failed to do this.

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Have they actually been offered a deal? I the BKS cant find 500k where does 20 million come from?

I smell Whyte

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I think Ticketus are close to CW and Ticketus have led P Murray on a merry dance.

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27 Apr 2012 10:18:41
Ticketus withdraw backing for BKs. Bill Miller and liquidation now best hope.
STV News

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Can't believe a person of Jardines age/experience is saying these things, he had just repeated ally's recent rant, as for fans threats to "punish" fellow premier league clubs by not travelling to away games , we won't be here next season... very v sad times.

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The most likely outcome is now liquidation, I do not believe TBKs will pay 30 million to CW for his shares.

Ticketus anticipate the current and future sanctions against Rangers will seriously affect its profitability. Its not worth the risk anymore, they will get their money back in full from CWs floating charge through the liquidaton sale of the assets.

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Its not a bad thing ticketus have withdrew there backing, there actually going to end up worse, they got offered a good deal by rangers with an initial 10 million up front then payments over a certain number of years, they were only meant to be getting 2.5 million a year in the first place, they will now more than likely get even less from a CVA or nothing from liquadation so its thier fault. I dont want them having any part of the club and good riddance


Blue Knights and Brian Kenndey full steam ahead

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Above post spot on, it was always the plan.

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I don't believe Ticketus will get nothing from either a CVA or liquidation, they have their liability secured through CWs floating charge.

They will get it all back.

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It wont be part of the plan if they don't accept the cva....they might expect more from the sale of Hectors House & other assets.

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One thing, Ticketus will get their money from RFC or CW, as CW has a floating charge which covers all the assets, Liquidation might be the best option for Ticketus i.e. assets fire sale. At this stage CW is clear as long as he is not out of pocket he could not care less weather Newco has a stadium or training facility. It is not a given if Rangers Liquidate that the newco keeps or transfer the assets, they have to negotiate this with CW, the cost will cover Ticketus minimum. Just my opinion as i am no legal expert

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Craig Whyte's secured creditor status is in place regardless of whither the club is in CVA or liquidation. It is highly debateable what the value and validity of the charge is. D&P have stated that in their opinion it is zero and does not stand. But again this is one for the lawyers. Ticketus may well have a personal claim for moneys from C Whyte, but as he remarked to the SFA it is unlikely that he will pay up. (or even that he has the money). And if he buggers of to say Pannama then the chances of getting anyting is almost nil (how much is grant castle worth? they might be able to seize that?)
So you see why Ticketus would rather come after rangers for the £20+million then Whyte

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27 Apr 2012 10:05:12
Ticketus announce they are not to be a part of any bid for Rangers. Rumour is as below that it can be proved Whyte owes them the money and not Rangers.

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Ticketus is set to announce that it will not fund any takeover bid for Rangers.

It is understood that the tough sanctions imposed on the Ibrox side by the SFA earlier this week were the decisive factor for the company.

A Ticketus source told STV News: “A lot has happened over the last few weeks and, especially after the SFA’s decision, we no longer think we can get a return for our investors.â€

Ticketus first came to prominence when it emerged Rangers owner Craig Whyte received £25.3m, with the company buying the rights to 100,000 season tickets for the next four years.

Whyte subsequently used the money to fund his takeover of an 85.3% shareholding of the club, paying off an £18m debt to Lloyds Banking Group.

After Rangers went into administration on February 14, Ticketus started discussions with potential buyers of the club, including the Blue Knights consortium and Singaporean businessman Bill Ng.

The company subsequently became part of the Blue Knights' formal takeover bid for Rangers, which was submitted on April 4.

still cant find the bit were whyte is at fault.

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At least £18 million went into Rangers bank account to pay off debt. So Rangers owe them the money.

Whyte is not personally involved except for the fact he is the cunning little b*****d who organised it and put Rangers further into the sh*t!

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I cannot beliave some of the rantings I read on this site. When Whyte first took over at Rangers the shouts were YAHOO a debt free Rangers, our SAVIOUR has paid off the Lloyds debt. Rangers were in debt to Lloyds, Whyte borrowed from Ticketus to pay Lloyds. Rangers owe Whyte. end of story

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Well since Whyte still owns rangers, i guess they can go after him and take the one big asset he has...Rangers....see what i'm getting at?Rangers was bought with Ticketus money and their debts where cleared with the bank by ticketus.....it's not that hard to understand.....take out Whyte, they take out Rangers...cause he owns it.Unless he sells it before then but why would he do that with a 27 million loss hanging over his head.he needs to at the bery least break even....what a mess...

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I believe rangers are now history whyte and murray should be proud of themselves the fact is it is their fault and have to carry the can. and also other so called companies who are rangers fans saying they dont want to see rangers football club die well it will unless you get your cheque books out oh i forgot you dont care about a great club about to be liquidated. the sfa have a balancing act regarding punishment they have to consider both sides punishing us for so called offences but they have to remember no rangers no sky tv deal because sky will pull out no doubts about it. i want a serious inquiry after this proccess. from duff and phelps handling off the proccess the handling of craig whyte's takeover which stinks and also was it an illegal takeover.

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Well when whyte came in and promised to spend on stadium and players was it unrealistic for rangers fans to get a bit excited? Who wouldn't? So yes we were led a merry dance by the liar but does that mean we deserve it? No. All we want is to win and if we can be entertained along the way happy days. What's wrong with that?

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27 Apr 2012 09:41:33
Ed, this not a rumour but it would be good if you can post. After all the media coverage on the situation at ibrox, with daily stories of how bad the club was/ is run and ex players, management seemily letting the club down with statements that are resentful and not helping. I would like to say the ones so far not letting the club down are the fans. I read with interest on this blog regularly and how the banter with Celtic supporters flow without getting nasty. Also most
Rangers fans are accepting that the club owners brought this situation about and are not looking to blame anyone else. I hope the supporters continue in this fashion and don't rise to the bait wich will be forthcoming from the Celtic support this weekend. They are entitled to their noise up and I hope rangers fans take it in the spirit of no more than banter. True rangers fans are showing a dignified stance and long may that continue.

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Well said, hope you club gets out of this mess in one piece.

Anorak.

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Well said OP. I'm sure most if not all Celtic fans that contribute in here are aware of the fact that this is a Rangers site and any ability for us to post comes because Ed allows us that platform to debate, banter with Rangers fans. It rarely gets nasty or Ed is the busiest man in the world behind the scenes lol.
Gaz
Gaz {Ed001's Note - the latter I am afraid!}

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Well said mate, I give a lot of stick in here and noise u up. But it's our west coast culture and banter/ competitiveness.
Good post.

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Absolutely, as a Don, with no allegiance to either Old Firm team, I would like to hope that any 'joy' that is taken by Celtic at the plight be taken as banter by the Rangers Fans.

Despite various posts here, I don't think any of us are taking any great delight in what is happening at Rangers.

I think it might be more of a collective "thank feck it didn't happen to us".

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Good post mate and Im sure the vast majority of rangers fans hold their own club to account and not just individuals. However someone better tell the morons phoning up the phone ins and tell them as they are looking to lay blame everywhere except on their own door step.

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I agree wholeheartedly with this sentiment. Most Rangers fans I know accept that the club has broken the rules and breached the trust of the fans badly and realise that the punishment that has been dished out by the SFA is about as lenient as it could have been in the circumstances. There are a few idiots who are absolutely indignant that Rangers have been punished at all thinking that the 10 point penalty imposed for liquidation is punishment enough but the (largely silent) majority are more realistic.

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I sign on to a Rangers fansite and Iam sad to say that none of my fellow Bears are as enlightened as those on this forum. It all seems to be blamed on every entity that has even a tenious lonk to RFC

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Haha, brilliant post Dons fan, had me in stitches!

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Brilliant post, as a fairly new poster on this site, I’ve got involved in the banter as its hard to resist. Ive also got some family who for some reason support your team.
So any ribbing is tongue and cheek, I genuinely do fell sorry and have respect for the majority of the rangers support, who have sensed that most of the present situation is down to DM & CW. Im sure that the Celtic fans will be giving it large on Sunday, but as you say it has to be expected and accepted, vice versa etc. Anyway good luck and its for fans like yourself I do hope there is a suitable outcome.

TheEssexHoops

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Great post m8, I love the banter between our two great clubs, but thats all it should be.
Lets hope we can banter for the next 100 years
Starting with a win for the hoops the weekend :-)

Oh and ed u are a true blue m8 keep up the great work. {Ed001's Note - I am offended! I am a RED! I would be disowned for being a blue in my family! Admittedly a different type of blue, but still, that hurt.}

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Word of advice on phone ins..... They select the biggest morons for entertainment value.... It's just the same as Jeremy Kyle.... So if you've been on there.......,,

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The team will be well fired up for Sunday as they know that if we lose it will be impossible to finish within 10 pts of Celtic hence making Celtic official champions on their own soil against us even in the eyes of those who are trying to claim a tainted title. As such I expect a draw.

Big G.

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Ed hope you have not been sneaking up to aberdeen on the train red scarf up the juke LOL hope it will be a good game on sunday {Ed001's Note - oh god no! Aberdeen looks too cold for my liking. There is only one team for me, though I do have a soft spot for Stirling Albion as they were very helpful when I was first starting up the original site.}

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27 Apr 2012 09:28:55
Ticketus withdrawing funding from rangers bids :( source Stv

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Whats with the sad face? Its beyond me
How they (ticketus and whyte) were able to make a deal in the first place, would rather see them in court than make a deal,.....govan_front87

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If Ticketus are withdrawing funding then its liquidation( CWs 30 million floating charge) or TBKs are going to pay CW 30 million for his shares.

Either way CW will recover his liability and return it to Ticketus.

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There is absolutely no mention anywhere of Ticketus chasing Whyte for the money. The STV article is actually wrong in detail. As Lord hodge summed up... Whyte entered the contract with Ticketus and got the money nine days AFTER he legally owned the club from SDM. It's still a Rangers - Ticketus contract... No doubt about that.

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The sad face is because liquidation is now the most likely outcome, the only hope is CWs floating charge is bogus.

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Liquidation will be avoided, stop puffn
The green herbs n relax, theres no
Point in worryn ts out of our hands and there is nothing the fans can do, protests and all will b a waste of time,we as fans r just puppets lining the pockets of they whi r bleeding us dry

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27 Apr 2012 07:55:33
BKs and Brian Kennedy to complete takeover today and they have dumped ticketus.
Ticketus debt ...they have been advised ,is Whytes debt not Gers.

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Even if something was agreed in principle it will not be completed today.

Big G.

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Nobody will make a move until they've seen the result of the appeal and the meeting of the other 10.

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Craig Whyte and Rangers are the same thing. The deal with Ticketus was a Rangers deal.

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Ticketus have left TBK.
Quoting SFA sanction which sounds like a BK ruse to get the SFA to repeal its logical and balanced decision made through a fair process.

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The blue knights only thing going for them was the ticketus debt restructure. They were bringing no money.
D&P will not be able to accept a Kennedy BK bid unless someone's throwing in £20m extra.

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They cannot complete a takeover lol.
They can only enter a period of 'exclusivity' for a few months. But they have to hand over £500k non refundable.

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Haw haw ticketus out as blackmail to SFA and when transfer penalty removed on appeal, they're back in the frame again. How dumb are these guys?

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Miller's getting the club then lads.

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. Take it you've been up all night believeing that bunch of tripe on Rangersmedia from the poster Gunslinger. .

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....in competition with a late joint bid from Lord Lucan and Shergar.

Get real, Whyte will not sell his 85% of the club to anybody if he is holding the Ticketus liability. Whoever puts in an offer has to deal with Whyte or its liquidation and a Tesco!

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I so hope this rumour is true

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If it is Whytes debt then Whyte will recover the debt through his floating charge over the assets. There is no debate that Whyte put the money into RFC and therefore RFC owe him the money.

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Question to previous post: does that not mean whyte joins the list of creditors?

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If Ticketus go after CW for the money.
CW gets his slice through the assets to pay them off.
Someone will have to stump up 27 mill (cost for CW to satisy Ticketus) for a combination or all off Ibrox, Murray Park, and the shares.

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"Craig Whyte and Rangers are the same thing. The deal with Ticketus was a Rangers deal."
--

What nonsense, CW has personally guaranteed the money. If Rangers refuse to pay then CW is legally entitled to pay the money.

The issue is then whether or not CW's shares could be aquired by the Administrators which would mean another potentially fatal (time) court case

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I just wonder how long Kennedy will be willing to throw his cash into a Club with cash flow problems! He could like SDM lose millions! But good luck to them if it comes off!

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27 Apr 2012 06:56:54
Rumour that Paul Lambert will take over from Alex McLeish at Aston Villa freeing up McLeish to replace Ally McCoist at Ibrox at the end of this season.
McCoist widely viewed as a footballing and PR liability.

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Absolute mince,,,,norwich fans want rid of lambert because hes a dud,,,,,,as for big eck,,,,one relegation and what looks like another or a near miss 2 years in a trot,,,,,,,,,,,,,SUPER ALLY
MORE THAN JUST A MANAGER
IN COISTY WE TRUST {Ed001's Note - Norwich fans want rid of Lambert? They love him! The Norwich editor on the sites has panic attacks every time a managerial job becomes available in case Lambert takes it.}

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McLeish is a good manager who was on a hiding to nothing at villa. If the fans don't want you it'll never work. but seriously. Things were tight when he was here before no way would come back with present problems. No one will take a job where you can't sign a player for 12 months.

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Utter nonsense. Ally McCoist has been in a no win situation all season. No money for transfers, Jelavic sold,forced pay cuts and all the rest of the baggage. Yet the guy has tried his best for the club he loves. Difficult to motivate players under the circumstaces yet we have won 2 out of 3 Old Firm games.

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Seriously who posts this nonsense?

McCoist will not leave and he has too much backing from the support generally - he has come off with some crazy stuff lately because he has been speaking on emotion and as a fan. I have found it odd in general this season that he is so poor in front of the cameras given his tv experience.

Also McLeish will not be back as things stand.

Big G.

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More chance of RFC daft LAMBERT (begged Rangers to save him from having to sign for the darkside) than BIG Eck coming back utter rubbish

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Why would Paul Lambert want to manage Aston Villa when there is a still a real possibility they will be relegated.

And Alex McLeish to Rangers, I strongly doubt that, Rangers may not even be in the premier league next season

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I do believe Mcleish will no be at Aston Villa next year.

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Alex mcleishs tenure was the start of the slide and he is one of the worst managers in the business. hes arrogant greedy and wont chuck a job even when hes hated by the fans because he wants his pay off . he only got the job up here because they were looking for a cheap manager when advocatt went upstairs i wouldnt let him manage a toilet.

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I believe that Pep Guardiola is now available.

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On August 8 2009 Paul Lambert's Colchester won 7-1 at Carrow Road, that was arguably the last time any Canary was critical of Lambert. He became their manager 10 days later, winning the league that season including an equally remarkable 5-0 win at Colchester. The next year promotion to the Premiership followed and an equally creditable showing in the EPL. He is ADORED in Norwich as Ed rightly points out, more facts less mince please OP
Gaz

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McLeish did better than McCoist with a less valuable squad.

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The same Lambert who has newly promoted Nowrich kicking ass in the top half of the table is a dud?

The same Rangers daft Lambert who said if it had been Celtic who bid for Grant Holt that he would drive him up the road himself?

Aye OK lads.

I hope it is McCleish who takes over as he has a lot of experience of getting teams relegated.

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Bull IN ALLY WE TRUST!

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To all the McLeish doubters: McLeish got the Gers to the last 16 of the Champions League - when will that happen again? This rumour is lies though - Eck won't be back.

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McLeish squad was more experienced and more expensive. Arteta. 6 mill. De Boers. Arveladze. Prso Rodriguez. Klos. Boumsong. Ferguson. I know he didn't sign all of them and some were frees but wages were big.

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Not a gers fan but you really cant say All is a PR failure, quite the opposite. A football falure yes most definately.

Why would you want Alex back. I believe he was on an EBT

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Utter s**t he has conducted himself correctly. why would we want mcleish back?
Walter has stated he would come back for nothing if asked in any capacity unpaid.

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